Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Judge rejects Purdue Pharma's $4.5B opioid settlement

axios.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 93 posts

Re: Judge rejects Purdue Pharma's $4.5B opioid settlement

#41

Post by subpixel »

GeekyBear wrote: post #18
tialaramex wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem was never that they don't work the problem was that they're addictive . So since they do work this means it remains appropriate to prescribe them, it just isn't appropriate to give them to everybody to pop one every day before work and say it's "non-addictive". Drugs that work but have a terrible reputation are almost always still available. For example Thalidomide works, but it causes birth defects. Well…

We learned the lesson that opioids are too addictive to be used to treat everyday pain back in the 1970's. However, Purdue Pharma's claim to fame with opioids was that their time release formulation was not addictive, so unlike traditional opioids these could be safely used on a daily basis. Obviously, this claim was fraudulent. Opioids still have their place, for treating terminal cancer patients, for instance. Shor…

I was given an opioid via IV to prep for surgery in my 20s and while that dosage was by design higher than standard Oxycontin prescriptions, people just use more OxyContin to achieve similar effect.

It’s very hard to describe the effect except to say it’s like a form of ecstasy (the feeling, not the drug) that is far more consuming and also more referable than I’d believe, had I not experienced it firsthand.

For years after that five minutes or so of being sky-high I could conjure up the physical sensation and I absolutely craved it.

The Purdues basically weaponized this chemical for profit, knowing full well the human consequences, and they should lose it all.

Re: Judge rejects Purdue Pharma's $4.5B opioid settlement

#42

Post by simon_o »

S_A_P wrote: post #11
starklevnertz wrote: post #3

Can anyone explain why opioids are still being sold and prescribed?

As someone who had major surgery a few months ago I am glad they are for sale and prescribed. No I am not taking opioids now but in the few days after surgery they kept me mostly pain free. Perdue deserves to be punished. Opioids are a public health crisis when abused. That doesn’t mean that they don’t have legitimate uses.

Why are Americans so ... feeble?

In most other places of the world, pain is simply expected and accepted after a surgery.

Re: Judge rejects Purdue Pharma's $4.5B opioid settlement

#43

Post by sfifs »

starklevnertz wrote: post #3

Can anyone explain why opioids are still being sold and prescribed?

One of my family members gets terrible debilitating migraines. When they get it, the whole day gets lost, vomiting, dehydration, maybe a trip to urgent care.

An opioid based tablet they are prescribed for migraine cuts this to about 2 hours. The tablet is issued only by the clinic itself or in a major hospital pharmacy and you can't buy it in regular pharmacies.

The problem in US is lack of controls and perverse profit incentives in the American healthcare business.

Re: Judge rejects Purdue Pharma's $4.5B opioid settlement

#44

Post by moron4hire »

> Steve Miller, chair of the Purdue board of directors, said in an emailed statement that the ruling "will delay, and perhaps end, the ability of creditors, communities, and individuals to receive billions in value to abate the opioid crisis."

> "These funds are needed now more than ever as overdose rates hit record-highs, and we are confident that we can successfully appeal this decision and deliver desperately needed funds to the communities and individuals suffering in the midst of this crisis," Miller added.

I mean, if that's what you're concerned about, you can just do that now, without a court decision. You can just spend money on opiod addiction relief. You fucking muppet.

Re: Judge rejects Purdue Pharma's $4.5B opioid settlement

#45

Post by brennebeck »

rand_r wrote: post #24
tialaramex wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem was never that they don't work the problem was that they're addictive . So since they do work this means it remains appropriate to prescribe them, it just isn't appropriate to give them to everybody to pop one every day before work and say it's "non-addictive". Drugs that work but have a terrible reputation are almost always still available. For example Thalidomide works, but it causes birth defects. Well…

The idea that opioids are addictive is a myth. People taking them are treating “pain” that isn’t diagnosed in the medical system. For example, joblessness. It’s an easy scapegoat for politicians to let them avoid dealing with harder structural problems.

>The idea that opioids are addictive is a myth.

They have literal physical withdrawals. The body becomes dependent on them. What else would you call that?

Re: Judge rejects Purdue Pharma's $4.5B opioid settlement

#47

Post by hellbannedguy »

rand_r wrote: post #24
tialaramex wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem was never that they don't work the problem was that they're addictive . So since they do work this means it remains appropriate to prescribe them, it just isn't appropriate to give them to everybody to pop one every day before work and say it's "non-addictive". Drugs that work but have a terrible reputation are almost always still available. For example Thalidomide works, but it causes birth defects. Well…

The idea that opioids are addictive is a myth. People taking them are treating “pain” that isn’t diagnosed in the medical system. For example, joblessness. It’s an easy scapegoat for politicians to let them avoid dealing with harder structural problems.

Yea, I agree, but will not go as far as saying they are not addictive. At high doses they are. Point me to a study claiming they arn't at high doses.

I must have taken 10 antidepressants over the years. It all started with a run of the mill panic attack, but morphed into daily Generalized Anxiety. Debilitating, but according to my doctor not enough to get SSDI.

My father died, and a nurse I knew saw how much I was drinking. She gave me a couple of Norcos.

I finally felt normal.

I didn't fall into begging/robbing for the drug.

A doctor who heard my story prescribed bupenorpine off label for symptoms of depression.

It's not nearly as good as vicodin, but I've been on it (same dose) for over decade.

There are a lot of studies that conclude if you give opoids to certain people, they are fine with the original dose. (These studies were mainly performed in senior citizens, and rest homes though.)

My point is opoids feel good, and can make a lousy life rosy. The consciousness patient will not seek higher, and higher doses, I think?

We will probally never know now.

I do have some accuantances whom are in extreme pain every day, and everyone of their doctors cut them off of opoids.

No one is talking about the people who didn't abuse their meds, but were cut off, or told to go home and taper off, and take useless NASID's.

Re: Judge rejects Purdue Pharma's $4.5B opioid settlement

#48

Post by GeekyBear »

sidewndr46 wrote: post #35
GeekyBear wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We learned the lesson that opioids are too addictive to be used to treat everyday pain back in the 1970's. However, Purdue Pharma's claim to fame with opioids was that their time release formulation was not addictive, so unlike traditional opioids these could be safely used on a daily basis. Obviously, this claim was fraudulent. Opioids still have their place, for treating terminal cancer patients, for instance. Shor…

The way I understand it is that time release opioids are in fact not addictive when used as directed by the manufacturer. However, they are also ineffective for most patients. As a result, doctors just up the dosage. This winds up being effective and addictive for many patients. This is just what I have read, I have never been addicted to anything.

They are addictive. Purdue knew they were addictive.

2007

>ABINGDON, Va., May 10 — The company that makes the narcotic painkiller OxyContin and three current and former executives pleaded guilty today in federal court here to criminal charges that they misled regulators, doctors and patients about the drug’s risk of addiction and its potential to be abused.

Also, in a rare move, three executives of Purdue Pharma, including its president and its top lawyer, pleaded guilty today as individuals to misbranding, a criminal violation. They agreed to pay a total of $34.5 million in fines.

https://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/10/business/11drug-web.html

2020

>Purdue admits it illegally and misleadingly marketed its opioids, including “to more than 100 health care providers whom the company had good reason to believe were diverting opioids” for misuse; illegally paid doctors to prescribe more opioids; and took part in other fraudulent and illegal practices. Purdue says it did all of this between 2007 and at least 2017 — after a separate guilty plea in 2007 forced the company to pay more than $600 million in fines.

https://www.vox.com/2020/10/21/21526868/purdue-pharma-oxycon...

Re: Judge rejects Purdue Pharma's $4.5B opioid settlement

#49

Post by BrazzVuvuzela »

323 wrote: post #46

Quoted post unavailable.

> I find these two positions very hard to re-conciliate.

Why do you need to reconcile them? "HN" is not a person and does not need to have consistent beliefs. "HN" is a loose association of independent people who believe different things and choose to comment on different matters. If you think some individual is being hypocritical, take it up with them.

Re: Judge rejects Purdue Pharma's $4.5B opioid settlement

#50

Post by MexicanMonkey »

323 wrote: post #46

Quoted post unavailable.

IMO these two positions are no hard to re-conciliate. The thing about "drugs should be legal and available" is that it should go hand-in-hand with honest information about those drugs. What evil pharma companies do is lie and misrepresent information about those drugs. The amount of incorrect marketing done about OxyContin is just insane.
Post reply on HN