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AWS Tools Suck

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Re: AWS Tools Suck

#31

Post by pid-1 »

cle wrote: post #4

Long ago AWS reached the point where feature prioritization was discussed in terms of millions of $$ in revenue. When you have CTOs at Fortune 500 companies waving 10s of millions of dollars in front of your face to build a feature, it's much much easier to prioritize building that over one that is requested by smaller developers with uncertain revenue impact. > The only conclusion is: bad tooling isn't affecting the…

> I actually think bad tooling does affect their sales and long-term growth,

Anecdotally, I know a fair amount of companies that gave up on using AWS native stuff and went to EKS for the K8s tooling and ecosystem.

Re: AWS Tools Suck

#32

Post by pid-1 »

xmodem wrote: post #18

I got bitten recently by AWS documentation. Several pages strongly imply something to be true, which in practise was 100% false. If I'd wanted to make a living reading text between the lines to work out how they're trying to fuck me, I'd have gone into law.

+1

Also their docs suck at saying the limitations of their services explicitly in a transparent way.

Re: AWS Tools Suck

#33

Post by mschuster91 »

> Reason 2: AWS doesn't sell based on Dev Ex

Hard disagree here. The reason why AWS can get away with shoddy tooling is that the competition is orders of magnitude worse. Azure's web UI is an unmitigated desaster, and while I never used GCE I can say I won't ever use it for the simple fear of some "AI" running amok and killing off my Google account - too many horror stories here on HN for my taste.

Re: AWS Tools Suck

#34

Post by decidertm »

pid-1 wrote: post #29
decidertm wrote: post #14

Yes they might suck, but that's because of its success and the complexity of the problem - it'll get better over time. However aws-sdk doesn't need to be 70mb, the console doesn't need to be slow and they don't need over 10 unique services to deploy containers. We're working on a much improved dev ex for cloud providers and Kubernetes at https://northflank.com - with a fast real-time console, a well documented and us…

Your product looks really cool, but just a heads up as a potential customer: On your cloud >> talk to sales Every SaaS firm on earth wants me to talk with their sales, I'm tired of that. From 2022 and beyond, if you can't give me some Databricks style onboarding, you're not getting my money.

Hi pid, thank you for the kind words. Agreed that's not our intention. You can signup self-serve at the moment and get access to the entire platform + free developer tier with our infrastructure. On your cloud is currently a manual on-boarding with our engineers, in the new year it will be also self-service.

Re: AWS Tools Suck

#35

Post by 2ion »

> Reason 2: AWS doesn't sell based on Dev Ex

AWS's core is developer experience.

AWS is an API. Anybody who does not realize or can not exploit this fact this pays massive premiums for using it (probably a lot of businesses which should have no business using AWS directly).

The application tooling is extra. And as far as I can tell, AWS is the only major public cloud that has decent coverage by tools of any flavour against their API, and they have the most decent set of language SDKs available. I am not familiar with GCP but anything Azure puts on the table is a catastrophe when compared to the ease of using boto3 to get a certain flow working.

Admittedly, their console has some defects it ought not to have, but with some systems and software development knowledge, you can grok all of the tooling AWS releases pretty easily.

The biggest of my problems with AWS that besides their API, some of their managed services are just not on the quality level as their core services (ec2, s3, ...).

Re: AWS Tools Suck

#36

Post by moltar »

I don’t know, maybe I’m In the minority, but I quite like the tool chain around AWS.

AWS CDK is a breakthrough in infra as code. It will be the standard in a few years to come.

AWS SDK v3 is quite ok and will get better soon.

AWS CLI is maintained and has everything well documented.

Most popular services work well together.

IAM is very powerful and a well thought out solution.

Re: AWS Tools Suck

#37

Post by harshaw »

rk06 wrote: post #9
angarg12 wrote: post #6

> This is not a case of “not enough resources'', this is a case of the project not getting the internal priority to invest in improvement. This is only partly true. Fun fact: Amazon is so big and the churn so high, that hiring talent has become the bottleneck. So yes, parts of Amazon have prioritised new/more features over improving existing ones, and some are drowning in a sea of legacy. But also parts simply don't…

> churn so high, that hiring talent has become the bottleneck. It was a matter of time for that to happen. Amazon is infamous for having a firing quota, and infamous for Hiring managers to hire people, to fulfill said quota. As long as these practices remain, the situation will only worsen for Amazon

There is no firing quota.

Re: AWS Tools Suck

#38

Post by bamboozled »

2ion wrote: post #35

> Reason 2: AWS doesn't sell based on Dev Ex AWS's core is developer experience. AWS is an API. Anybody who does not realize or can not exploit this fact this pays massive premiums for using it (probably a lot of businesses which should have no business using AWS directly). The application tooling is extra. And as far as I can tell, AWS is the only major public cloud that has decent coverage by tools of any flavour a…

> AWS is an API. Anybody who does not realize or can not exploit this fact this pays massive premiums for using it (probably a lot of businesses which should have no business using AWS directly).

It's a freaking huge API and all of us would suck a little bit more of it without tooling around it.

Re: AWS Tools Suck

#39

Post by rk06 »

harshaw wrote: post #37
rk06 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> churn so high, that hiring talent has become the bottleneck. It was a matter of time for that to happen. Amazon is infamous for having a firing quota, and infamous for Hiring managers to hire people, to fulfill said quota. As long as these practices remain, the situation will only worsen for Amazon

There is no firing quota.

According to multiple sources, Amazon has a policy to have 6% UnRegrettedAtiration. which in normal speak is 6% of employees to be fired per year. and managers are expected to fullfil this quota, and backfil it if they failed to meet it previously.

Here is a recent news mentioning it: https://www.arkansasonline.com/news/2021/jun/27/amazons-unre...

Re: AWS Tools Suck

#40

Post by fmajid »

nix23 wrote: post #30
peakaboo wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess some people work for shitty companies because it makes their cv look "good"? And the pay is probably decent too. But personally, never ever working for a big American tech company. They have no soul.

>But personally, never ever working for a big American tech company. They have no soul. Bell Laboratory's was a thing....

That's because T.N. Vail was a visionary leader. They are in short supply nowadays.
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