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Work/life balance should be difficult

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Re: Work/life balance should be difficult

#51

Post by as300 »

aulin wrote: post #48
Ancapistani wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "We need work" is a social fact, nothing more, and it's only true as much as it's believed to be true. Having gone through a handful of periods of a few months where I wasn’t working and was also not engaged in an existential struggle for survival, I have to disagree here. Personally, I know that I need a focus for my intellectual life. It needn’t be employment, but “work” is a fair way to describe it. I can spend…

That's not work, that's life. The opposite of working is not idling, it is spending your time in activities that realize your self without being constrained by the survival struggle.

I think his point (and the broader point being assumed by the author) was that "spending your time in activities that realize your self" does, in fact, feel a lot like work.

Re: Work/life balance should be difficult

#52

Post by kelseyfrog »

amw-zero wrote: post #27
kelseyfrog wrote: post #24

> We need work. Not sure I follow. It's amazing how these little bits of social knowledge ferment the flavor of the story. It's a lot like learning to taste beer or wine. Once you take the time to sit down and learn to pay attention to your senses, you can identify things like acetaldehyde, diacetyl, and mercaptans. It's fun teaching people how to sense things they weren't aware of before. The author seems to have do…

Work is generally a proxy for survival. Do you agree that you need to eat in order to survive?

Everyone agrees that people need to do certain things to survive. What complicates this line of thinking are the social facts that are assumed when we conceptualize work. The way that work is conceptualized is culturally specific across space and time. The construction "eating implies survival implies work" doesn't imply that our culturally specific conceptualization of work is implied. There are many interesting ways to have conversations about work means, how it changes, and what factors influence how people think about what work is and isn't.

Re: Work/life balance should be difficult

#53

Post by 20211215throw »

Ancapistani wrote: post #33
kelseyfrog wrote: post #24

> We need work. Not sure I follow. It's amazing how these little bits of social knowledge ferment the flavor of the story. It's a lot like learning to taste beer or wine. Once you take the time to sit down and learn to pay attention to your senses, you can identify things like acetaldehyde, diacetyl, and mercaptans. It's fun teaching people how to sense things they weren't aware of before. The author seems to have do…

> "We need work" is a social fact, nothing more, and it's only true as much as it's believed to be true. Having gone through a handful of periods of a few months where I wasn’t working and was also not engaged in an existential struggle for survival, I have to disagree here. Personally, I know that I need a focus for my intellectual life. It needn’t be employment, but “work” is a fair way to describe it. I can spend…

> Having gone through a handful of periods of a few months where I wasn’t working and was also not engaged in an existential struggle for survival, I have to disagree here.

Sure but that is taking a short break from your job/career. Its not like leaving school and never working.

Re: Work/life balance should be difficult

#54

Post by psyc »

Ancapistani wrote: post #33
kelseyfrog wrote: post #24

> We need work. Not sure I follow. It's amazing how these little bits of social knowledge ferment the flavor of the story. It's a lot like learning to taste beer or wine. Once you take the time to sit down and learn to pay attention to your senses, you can identify things like acetaldehyde, diacetyl, and mercaptans. It's fun teaching people how to sense things they weren't aware of before. The author seems to have do…

> "We need work" is a social fact, nothing more, and it's only true as much as it's believed to be true. Having gone through a handful of periods of a few months where I wasn’t working and was also not engaged in an existential struggle for survival, I have to disagree here. Personally, I know that I need a focus for my intellectual life. It needn’t be employment, but “work” is a fair way to describe it. I can spend…

I recommend Factorio and Shenzhen IO as alternative forms of self employment. And it’s true self employment, in that you’ll need to pay yourself too.

Re: Work/life balance should be difficult

#55

Post by UnpossibleJim »

He says "Work" and uses it as a synonym for "Career". I'm not sure about anyone else (though having read enough posts on this site, I know I speak for many), there are many kinds of work. I get log off from my job, these days, and play with my son and while he's being put to bed (no mean feat for my wife these days... I'd help if he'd allow it), I crack open the personal Linux box and start in on Rust code with the Bevy engine, for no reason other than self fulfillment.

It's work, of a sort. I'm not sure I'd call it fun. It has ups and downs, but not fun, exactly. There's definitely a learning curve, and some of it might help me in my career, but I kind of doubt it... maybe in the most ethereal sense. All the same, it's work. Probably the most fulfilling work I do all day. But it has definitive goals that are attainable, kind of like the MMO's I used to love playing. I entertain wonderful ideas about selling a product that will never happen and I'm not sure I'd want to do it even if it was a viable product. Being a developer and a salesman/CEO are so vastly different, I wouldn't want to make the switch really. There are days I don't even enjoy managing the small team I do, and they're nice.

I hop on the treadmill or bike, hit the weights in the garage, and I hate them... and that's work. But I do it. That one's practice with a purpose, though, so I'm not sure that gets lumped in.

I know other people who garden like it's their born profession when they get home. It's amazing. People who knit and sew. Hunters who take it to extreme levels and stockpile meat for the year. All of it work, while they still have careers.

Re: Work/life balance should be difficult

#56

Post by aulin »

as300 wrote: post #51
aulin wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not work, that's life. The opposite of working is not idling, it is spending your time in activities that realize your self without being constrained by the survival struggle.

I think his point (and the broader point being assumed by the author) was that "spending your time in activities that realize your self" does, in fact, feel a lot like work.

And that's true for a limited subset of people lucky to work in a field where the two aspects overlap.

Re: Work/life balance should be difficult

#58

Post by jfzoid »

Ancapistani wrote: post #33
kelseyfrog wrote: post #24

> We need work. Not sure I follow. It's amazing how these little bits of social knowledge ferment the flavor of the story. It's a lot like learning to taste beer or wine. Once you take the time to sit down and learn to pay attention to your senses, you can identify things like acetaldehyde, diacetyl, and mercaptans. It's fun teaching people how to sense things they weren't aware of before. The author seems to have do…

> "We need work" is a social fact, nothing more, and it's only true as much as it's believed to be true. Having gone through a handful of periods of a few months where I wasn’t working and was also not engaged in an existential struggle for survival, I have to disagree here. Personally, I know that I need a focus for my intellectual life. It needn’t be employment, but “work” is a fair way to describe it. I can spend…

> Personally, I know that I need a focus for my intellectual life. It needn’t be employment, but “work” is a fair way to describe it.

"It is difficult for a man who always has a full stomach to put his mind to some use. Are there not players of liubo and go? Even playing these games is better than being idle." -- Confucious

Re: Work/life balance should be difficult

#59

Post by dionidium »

kelseyfrog wrote: post #24

> We need work. Not sure I follow. It's amazing how these little bits of social knowledge ferment the flavor of the story. It's a lot like learning to taste beer or wine. Once you take the time to sit down and learn to pay attention to your senses, you can identify things like acetaldehyde, diacetyl, and mercaptans. It's fun teaching people how to sense things they weren't aware of before. The author seems to have do…

> "We need work" is a social fact, nothing more, and it's only true as much as it's believed to be true. To me it stands out like pickle in pancake, maybe it can for you too.

Something I believe, but can't really prove is that this is completely wrong and there's very little about the need for "work" that's socially determined. We are biological creatures that evolved under very specific circumstances. And "work" in the most basic sense is a big part of that. We need to be struggling to feed ourselves (or simulating it) -- every day. Most of us wither and die when that need is removed.

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