Web3 is going just great • Hacker News Board

Re: Web3 is going just great

#161

Post by tbabb » Tue, Dec 14, 2021, 9:01 PM UTC

baby wrote: post #122

tux3 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, that's a good argument for why you shouldn't dismiss a show or a thing in general based only on negative secondhand impressions. The lesson to takeaway is that you should judge a thing by its own quality, not by your negative impression of the fanbase. But from that, there is no way you should conclude that cynicism is wrong in general. You should not overreact to too much cynicism by discarding criticism entirel…

I don't think that's GP's conclusion. GP's conclusion is that crypto is rooted in real innovation and the noise surrounding it gives the false impression that the tech is just a scam.

It's not clear that the impression is false.

Re: Web3 is going just great

#162

Post by jay_kyburz » Tue, Dec 14, 2021, 9:01 PM UTC

OnlineGladiator wrote: post #115

deltarholamda wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Decentralized proof of ownership is the core merit, as I see it. That has some value, and NFTs are kind of the perfect vehicle to use the technology. But does it have any practical use? That's the question. NFTs are hot right now as an investment vehicle, or as a way for artists to sell unique creations (leading to investment vehicles, I suppose). I'm not sold on the utility, long term.

> Decentralized proof of ownership is the core merit > But does it have any practical use? That's the question. Sounds like a solution searching for a problem.

I always thought we only owned things because a central authority says we do.

Re: Web3 is going just great

#163

Post by CedarMills » Tue, Dec 14, 2021, 9:01 PM UTC

I'm not a Web3 hater - but I think VCs lighting the fuel with money is to blame. Now, every wantrepreneur is launching some sort of "decentralized" product and trying to capitalize on the hype. We'll see most of these projects die in the next 18 months as people move on to the next hyped topic.

I think at the end of the day, Web3, like VR, will have certain use cases that will make sense but won't have a huge effect on majority of the population.

Re: Web3 is going just great

#164

Post by paisawalla » Tue, Dec 14, 2021, 9:02 PM UTC

dvt wrote: post #87

I'm not a Web3 shill, but this is so insanely disingenuous it's not even funny. First of all, the argument that web3 is the biggest ecological problem of our time -- when essentially all of Asia is contributing 80% of ocean pollution, and the supply chain contributes to more than 50% of greenhouse gas emissions, is just straight-up delusional. The claim that Web3 is rife with hacks, when you have daily hacks of Web2…

The argument from climate/eco concerns is the most insipid, bad faith argument of them all. It both misunderstands how electricity is generated and consumed, and how necessary POW is to any of this. I feel strongly that nobody can make a nuanced, rational, good faith case against crypto on this basis without also condemning a host of frivolities we take for granted (and make life worth living).

But tbh, I feel that's probably the point.

Re: Web3 is going just great

#165

Post by tdrdt » Tue, Dec 14, 2021, 9:02 PM UTC

I'm into webdevelopment since 1999 but I still don't know what web2 is.

As a matter of fact the internet did not change that much as most people think. Ofcourse CSS changed and made things easier, Javascript is making application development more easy but in the end we are still transferring text and media.

Maybe the biggest change came when browser plugins started listening to http traffic. The change to https was one of the fastest on the internet and right now almost all our interactions on the web are 'secure'.

While I think blockchain tech is in some sense a new idea, I don't think it will change the internet very soon. I think it will come as soon as ipv6.

Re: Web3 is going just great

#166

Post by sneak » Tue, Dec 14, 2021, 9:02 PM UTC

acdha wrote: post #104

dvt wrote: post #87

I'm not a Web3 shill, but this is so insanely disingenuous it's not even funny. First of all, the argument that web3 is the biggest ecological problem of our time -- when essentially all of Asia is contributing 80% of ocean pollution, and the supply chain contributes to more than 50% of greenhouse gas emissions, is just straight-up delusional. The claim that Web3 is rife with hacks, when you have daily hacks of Web2…

Speaking of disingenuous, since when is log4j “web 2.0”? > The claim that Web3 is rife with hacks, when you have daily hacks of Web2 (are we just ignoring Log4j, which is a huge deal and happened 2 days ago) That’s also worth thinking less shallowly about for a second reason: if a cryptocurrency service, wallet, etc. you used was hacked due to log4j, you’d lose everything without recourse. This is not true of the mat…

"web 2.0" = centralized web application servers providing usually-json API backends for javascript clientside applications running in a browser. Usually written in Python, Ruby, Java, or PHP. Sometimes written in Perl or Go or Rust. Clicks are not usually full pageloads (that is, SPAs).

Many (maybe even most?) of those web 2.0 applications are written in Java and those that are, almost all of them use log4j.

(web1 was serverside rendering of html, sending down complete html pages for each user interaction.)

Re: Web3 is going just great

#167

Post by jjordan » Tue, Dec 14, 2021, 9:03 PM UTC

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #73

fab1an wrote: post #48

I'm flabberghasted at the amount of hate this space is getting from parts of the dev community and in particular HN. Web3 has its fair share of issues, but there's community and energy in the space that I haven't seen online since the early days of the world wide web. Consider this: if you are absolutely, 100% convinced that all of this is bogus, is going to go nowhere (despite the high number of talented individuals…

> I'm flabberghasted at the amount of hate this space is getting from parts of the dev community and in particular HN. Web3 has its fair share of issues, but there's community and energy in the space that I haven't seen online since the early days of the world wide web. If you're familiar with the space, you have to at least admit that it's filled to the brim with grifters and people looking to acquire life-changing…

I've worked on and off in the crypto space for 4 years, and I've often said that crypto attracts some of the best and the absolute worst of humanity. The key, I think, is to realize that it's still very much a "wild west" industry, and there will be heartache to endure. We continue on because we believe in the unrealized potential of decentralization.

Re: Web3 is going just great

#168

Post by andybp85 » Tue, Dec 14, 2021, 9:03 PM UTC

fab1an wrote: post #48

I'm flabberghasted at the amount of hate this space is getting from parts of the dev community and in particular HN. Web3 has its fair share of issues, but there's community and energy in the space that I haven't seen online since the early days of the world wide web. Consider this: if you are absolutely, 100% convinced that all of this is bogus, is going to go nowhere (despite the high number of talented individuals…

there's some cool stuff going on in the NFT space, e.g. my favorite band has been selling NFTs that come with access to stuff like concert videos and private events. the idea of NFTs as access to a community i think has merit - hey, if you buy a Porsche, you can go to Porsche owners clubs and stuff. nothing wrong with that.

that being said, the main reason I haven't bought one (i'd love to see the concert) is you have to use ether. that means taking on something like forex risk, plus costs money and time for what feels like the sake of costing money and time. if i could buy one of the things in dollars with a card or paypal, i probably would.

i get (at least some of) the ideas behind using a value token that's endogenous to and therefore in the control of the software ensuring trust, etc., but it seems to me that the cool parts of NFTs are somewhat negated by the cryptocurrency part of the implementation.

Re: Web3 is going just great

#169

Post by ipaddr » Tue, Dec 14, 2021, 9:03 PM UTC

OnlineGladiator wrote: post #115

deltarholamda wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Decentralized proof of ownership is the core merit, as I see it. That has some value, and NFTs are kind of the perfect vehicle to use the technology. But does it have any practical use? That's the question. NFTs are hot right now as an investment vehicle, or as a way for artists to sell unique creations (leading to investment vehicles, I suppose). I'm not sold on the utility, long term.

> Decentralized proof of ownership is the core merit > But does it have any practical use? That's the question. Sounds like a solution searching for a problem.

You have described what a home computer was in the 80s. It found many problems.

Re: Web3 is going just great

#170

Post by Yizahi » Tue, Dec 14, 2021, 9:03 PM UTC

deltarholamda wrote: post #94

trunnell wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But the math and incentives are there. Can you elaborate on this? The best critiques of blockchain tech, cryptocurrencies, NFTs, DeFi, etc. describe fatal flaws at the core of those technologies. For example, the lack of monetary policy and regulations, privacy and security shortcomings, and high transaction costs. It'd be great to read a positive analysis of the core merits (the math and the incentives) and how th…

Decentralized proof of ownership is the core merit, as I see it. That has some value, and NFTs are kind of the perfect vehicle to use the technology. But does it have any practical use? That's the question. NFTs are hot right now as an investment vehicle, or as a way for artists to sell unique creations (leading to investment vehicles, I suppose). I'm not sold on the utility, long term.

> Decentralized proof of ownership is the core merit

But it's neither decentralized nor a proof AT ALL. NFT literally can't facilitate anything by itself, without adding some centralized DB to it and some centralized humans governing all interactions between clients.