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Americans are rethinking where they want to live

economist.com

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Re: Americans are rethinking where they want to live

#341

Post by criddell »

jacobolus wrote: post #283
criddell wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who is doing the subsidizing? You hear about cities annexing suburbs to access the tax base. If suburbs were a drain, wouldn't they be doing whatever the opposite of annexing is?

A few of the wealthiest suburbs in the country are enclaves of people who rely economically on the city but don’t want their property taxes to pay for poor people’s amenities and services, so carve out a separate municipality. Cities want to re-absorb these, because the current setup is grossly unfair. This is not representative of suburbs in general. Many suburbs, especially older ones whose infrastructure construct…

After asking this question I started reading more about it. The biggest subsidization is about mortgage interest tax deductions. I never thought about that as a subsidy, but I suppose it is. They should end it.

Re: Americans are rethinking where they want to live

#342

Post by TurkishPoptart »

ryandrake wrote: post #338
TurkishPoptart wrote: post #121

And part of it is what public schools are doing to our kids. My 6 year old is required to sit outdoors to eat her lunch in 40ish degree (F) weather, and is not allowed to socialized. My 5 year old has to wear a mask 7 hours a day against an illness that doesn't kill kids. I'm at my wit's end with these school administrators. Hoping to be in Wyoming in 6 months' time.

You might not have heard, but the illness does (albeit very infrequently) kill kids, but more likely, kids can bring it home and infect their older, more vulnerable family members. Which is what recently happened in my kid's school district, when some nitwit parent also "at their wit's end with these school administrators" sent their COVID infected kid to school.

My wife and I are vaccinated. Any other "vulnerably family member" can get vaccinated, too. Problem solved, right? It _is_ in the land of reason and rationality, but not in bizarro world, where our governor and school administrators seem to live.

Of course, since the beginning of time, our kids could transmit the influenza virus to "vulnerable family members" too, but we were wise enough not to subject them to humiliating practices such as having lunch by sitting in PNW winter-temperatures and barring socializing.

Re: Americans are rethinking where they want to live

#343

Post by gnicholas »

carom wrote: post #312
gnicholas wrote: post #190

For me, schools are a huge part of this. Zoom schooling has demonstrated how little learning actually happens during a day. Simultaneously, online alternatives have popped up/become popularized, and people are realizing how much more a student can learn through good/personalized remote learning. Parents who pay tens of thousands of dollars in property tax — largely for access to 'great schools' — are now able to move…

What are some of the online alternatives?

The people I know who have pulled their kids from public schools are either homeschooling or enrolling in online charter schools. This allows for a great degree of autonomy, and basically lets kids learn via whatever platform works for them. I've heard about people using informal platforms like Outschool and more formalized courses from Beast Academy or Potter.

Re: Americans are rethinking where they want to live

#344

Post by lotsofpulp »

kerbs wrote: post #318
lotsofpulp wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do those smaller downtowns thrive? The few I know usually have rich populations that do not mind spending more than what Costco/Target/Walmart/big grocery stores sell at. All it takes is the big box stores to setup camp 10 minutes outside of town and almost everyone with a car will opt to save money and shop there.

In my very anecdotal observation – these small downtown areas don't rely on retail as much as food and entertainment. It's where the best restaurants, brewpubs, and general hangouts are. If there is retail, it's _highly_ differentiated from Big Box.

Yes, but that is why there are so few places like that in the US. Not many people can afford to constantly eat out and consume entertainment at a sufficient frequency to keep those businesses going. And that was at the labor prices before the pandemic.

Re: Americans are rethinking where they want to live

#345

Post by more_corn »

honkycat wrote: post #233
0x0nyandesu wrote: post #209

If people on HN really want the urban life style to make any sense in America they need to start tackling the mental health / homeless problem. They talk about "the environment" but no one wants to talk about how my wife has to dodge human feces getting on and off public transportation. "It's just part of living in a vibrant city".... Give me a break.

This is just not true. Everyone is talking about the homeless problem all the time. NOBODY is happy about the homeless situation in our major cities. I don't know a single city, liberal, moderate, or conservative, that has solved it. I am just a single citizen, I pay out the ass for taxes, and nothing is being done to help these people. At this point is appears there is no political will to do anything. Instead every…

Housing First seemed to be working in Utah. They achieved 90% reduction in chronic homelessness.

A remarkably simple and cost-effective answer. Essentially it states “get people housing and then it’s way easier to treat the things making them homeless” plop someone in a home and then it’s easier to get medication to them and they stop showing up in the ER 4x a month. Get people housing and then you know where they are to check in on how dependency treatment is going. Psychiatric condition? Way easier to treat if they have a roof, heat, an address to send medication. It is actually cheaper than just doing nothing and allowing people to remain homeless.

But then they stopped funding it in 2015. “Man this remarkable looking approach stopped working!” “Oh? When?” “Right after we stopped funding it!” “Huh, weird.”

Re: Americans are rethinking where they want to live

#346

Post by dragonwriter »

gamblor956 wrote: post #337
ketzo wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, but you have to understand, when you say things like "Oakland == Syria" it's incredibly hard to take you (and the people who make complaints like this) seriously. I can walk four blocks and buy, like, 19 different lattes. I can walk two blocks and get on a train that takes me to downtown SF in 18 minutes. In a 10-minute drive I can get to literally any cuisine the world has to offer, and it's fucking delicious…

To further your point on the homeless: most of them aren't SF (or even Cali) locals. Their almost all drug addicts from other states who came to SF because they were told drugs were easy to get here and the weather's better than where they came from. Gov Rick Perry used to brag on national TV that Texas' solution to the homeless problem was to buy them tickets to California. And their director of health services rece…

> To further your point on the homeless: most of them aren't SF (or even Cali) locals

Yes, they are. SF’s own research on the homeless population identified that 70% lived in SF immediately before becoming homeless, 55% for over 10 years; the 30% who did not live in SF include 22% from elsewhere in CA and 8% from other states.

Migration and dumping from other states happens, but it's not the main source of homelessness.

Re: Americans are rethinking where they want to live

#347

Post by jacobolus »

eweise wrote: post #294
obstacle1 wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kids like suburbs just fine before they understand there's a big world out there outside the family unit. Often things fall apart after that phase. > I can't imagine that they would enjoy living in 2 bedroom apartment OK but that's a problem with a limited imagination, not how your kids would actually feel. Do you know that 90% of families in the world live in close quarters, in places like 2 bedroom apartments (or -…

"The negative social and environmental impact of a suburban lifestyle is unsustainable." That's a problem with a limited imagination. Cars are becoming electric. There are things called towns that exist in suburbia and can be reached easily by bike or walking.

The environmental impact of suburban lifestyle is not limited to personal transportation carbon emissions. It also involves huge amounts of expensive (in land and resources) infrastructure, and individual suburbanites have a much larger resource footprint than other people.

Re: Americans are rethinking where they want to live

#348

Post by strict9 »

honkycat wrote: post #306

I grew up in a rural town around 4 hours from St. Lois. I was MISERABLE. I HATED IT AS A KID! A short list of things I disliked: - Completely car dependent as a kid. If my parents didn't give me a ride I wasn't doing anything. Bicycling is not an option because people drive like maniacs and are not expecting bikes, so it is extremely dangerous. People love to haul ass on country roads. - Conservative values. My paren…

Every time I see an article about an exodus to rural America I am reminded of the rural America I grew up in, and frankly it's terrible compared to living in or near a city. For all the reasons you cite and so many more.

Of course cost of living is cheap in rural America, demand is low and supply is high for land far from modern conveniences.

Re: Americans are rethinking where they want to live

#349

Post by Supermancho »

sanderjd wrote: post #56
dekhn wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

we do, it's called kaiser and it's amazing. it's unlikely they will replace the more rapacious alternatives, however.

The people I know with Kaiser hate it. YMMV I guess!

I have had kaiser for over 40 years. Note Kaiser isn't available everywhere and I'm primarily talking about California+Washington State.

Kaiser has strengths and weaknesses, which is unsurprising in healthcare.

Dermatology is garage-level bad. Cardiac care is world class. Reconstructive surgery for joints is amazing. Pediatrics has always been great, since that's what Kaiser started with. Psych is mainly pharmacological, if you can be purely medicated it's great. If you have anything very exotic like McCune-Albright syndrome, they can't do anything but medicate you (which Kaiser is very liberal about). Yeah, Kaiser GenPrac are pretty low rent, but that's true everywhere for General Pracitioners.

My family (all Kaiser), my coworkers, and ofc myself, have had a lot of time with Kaiser. Yeah you can get better cardiac care at the NIH or neurological treatment at UCLA, but Kaiser will make the recommendation for you and you can get that treatment if you want.

Anyone who thinks Kaiser is categorically bad, doesn't know what they are talking about, imo. Go see an independent that has Blue Shield/Cigna/etc and it's not even a question.

Re: Americans are rethinking where they want to live

#350

Post by [deleted] »

honkycat wrote: post #233
0x0nyandesu wrote: post #209

If people on HN really want the urban life style to make any sense in America they need to start tackling the mental health / homeless problem. They talk about "the environment" but no one wants to talk about how my wife has to dodge human feces getting on and off public transportation. "It's just part of living in a vibrant city".... Give me a break.

This is just not true. Everyone is talking about the homeless problem all the time. NOBODY is happy about the homeless situation in our major cities. I don't know a single city, liberal, moderate, or conservative, that has solved it. I am just a single citizen, I pay out the ass for taxes, and nothing is being done to help these people. At this point is appears there is no political will to do anything. Instead every…

[deleted]
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