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Alarmed by Tesla’s self-driving test, state legislators demand answers from DMV

latimes.com

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Re: Alarmed by Tesla’s self-driving test, state legislators demand answers from DMV

#41

Post by beached_whale »

andrelayer wrote: post #6
gadnuk wrote: post #2

As they should, from all agencies involved. It is absolutely horrifying to see Tesla do this open beta test on public roads when no other non-Tesla entities (other cars, pedestrians, motorcyclists, bicyclists, etc) consented to being a part of a reckless experiment. Moreover, Tesla influencers on social media tend to cherry pick and show only the nicer parts of their FSD Beta drives where no incidents and disengageme…

There is the argument that they are already safer than human drivers though and it'd be morally objectionable to stop. Not saying I'm completely on that side, but it is a valid utilitarian argument.

Distracted human drivers are terrible. People, in general, are easily and eagerly distracted. Otherwise the distance per accident driven would be much much higher. https://insideevs.com/news/542336/tesla-miles-driven-between...

Re: Alarmed by Tesla’s self-driving test, state legislators demand answers from DMV

#42

Post by randyrand »

kadoban wrote: post #24
mcot2 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who is actively participating in the beta you couldn’t be more off base in your assertions. It sucks to see progress stifled by people that have no idea what they are talking about. With the thousands of people actively using the FSD Beta safely, show me significant evidence of an increased level of accidents that have occured. You can’t because the evidence does not exist.

"the evidence does not exist" because it's not true or because Tesla is hiding it? We should know which, and these legislators asking questions seems to be a good start towards getting answers.

How could Tesla hide something that happens on public roads?

If a tesla is at-fault, there’s another non-tesla party in the accident and police and dmv usually involved.

Re: Alarmed by Tesla’s self-driving test, state legislators demand answers from DMV

#43

Post by pengaru »

andrelayer wrote: post #6
gadnuk wrote: post #2

As they should, from all agencies involved. It is absolutely horrifying to see Tesla do this open beta test on public roads when no other non-Tesla entities (other cars, pedestrians, motorcyclists, bicyclists, etc) consented to being a part of a reckless experiment. Moreover, Tesla influencers on social media tend to cherry pick and show only the nicer parts of their FSD Beta drives where no incidents and disengageme…

There is the argument that they are already safer than human drivers though and it'd be morally objectionable to stop. Not saying I'm completely on that side, but it is a valid utilitarian argument.

That argument is bullshit built on aggregate Tesla Autopilot miles driven, which are largely cherry-picked ideal condition miles vs. human miles driven in all conditions.

Re: Alarmed by Tesla’s self-driving test, state legislators demand answers from DMV

#45

Post by thinkmassive »

dbsmith83 wrote: post #13

> ...cited the apparent poor performance of what Tesla calls Full Self-Driving beta, a $10,000 option that gives owners advanced automated driving features and allows them to test cutting-edge autonomous technologies on public roads. (Beta is a software term that describes a product not quite ready for general sale to the public.) Wait, does this mean people are actually paying extra money to become test dummies for…

People are paying to unlock advanced Autosteer features ($10k flat fee, or $199/mo) and a small subset of those are invited to the FSD Beta that enables these features on city streets in addition to highways

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29531598

Re: Alarmed by Tesla’s self-driving test, state legislators demand answers from DMV

#46

Post by rscho »

mcot2 wrote: post #10
gadnuk wrote: post #2

As they should, from all agencies involved. It is absolutely horrifying to see Tesla do this open beta test on public roads when no other non-Tesla entities (other cars, pedestrians, motorcyclists, bicyclists, etc) consented to being a part of a reckless experiment. Moreover, Tesla influencers on social media tend to cherry pick and show only the nicer parts of their FSD Beta drives where no incidents and disengageme…

As someone who is actively participating in the beta you couldn’t be more off base in your assertions. It sucks to see progress stifled by people that have no idea what they are talking about. With the thousands of people actively using the FSD Beta safely, show me significant evidence of an increased level of accidents that have occured. You can’t because the evidence does not exist.

Yes, let's wait for that evidence to manifest itself instead! Smashing idea!

Re: Alarmed by Tesla’s self-driving test, state legislators demand answers from DMV

#47

Post by rscho »

mcot2 wrote: post #38
kadoban wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"the evidence does not exist" because it's not true or because Tesla is hiding it? We should know which, and these legislators asking questions seems to be a good start towards getting answers.

Because its not true at all. Most major Tesla incidents of any kind make headlines from fires to accidents on AP. You should do some basic research on the topic. https://www.theverge.com/platform/amp/2021/10/21/22738834/te... The FUD is _insane_ with Tesla.

Do your own research! :-D

Re: Alarmed by Tesla’s self-driving test, state legislators demand answers from DMV

#48

Post by jondwillis »

staunch wrote: post #22

I'm a big fan of Tesla but I'm fairly certain that, at some point, they're going to voluntarily refund everyone the money they paid for self-driving. And, at some later point, they will probably make self-driving work but on a future generation of HW/SW. Genuine question: if this happens, will it kill Tesla to refund all of this money? I don't pay close enough attention to their financials to know myself. I assume (a…

Software isn’t really a problem. What hardware changes do you think Tesla will need to make to deliver on FSD, whether that ends up being actual level 5 or not?

it is also not that expensive to retrofit most new hardware, especially if it is just new silicon.

Re: Alarmed by Tesla’s self-driving test, state legislators demand answers from DMV

#50

Post by landa »

mcot2 wrote: post #16
sva_ wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> https://mobile.twitter.com/taylorogan/status/146940457943982... Damn, the part where he tried to take over and the car wouldn't let him for a while, was downright scary Reminds me of a famous quote... > "I'm sorry, Dave. I'm afraid I can't do that." I fell like there should be a hardware way of taking over that overwrites anything the software does.

There is. Tapping the brake pedal.

Exactly. If you press the brakes the system gives complete control back to the driver. It's interesting to see all of the comments about the "horrifying" experiments Tesla is doing, and quoting science fiction movies about how robots are going to murder you. So much sensationalism.
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