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NewLimit: a company built to extend human healthspan

blog.newlimit.com

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Re: NewLimit: a company built to extend human healthspan

#101

Post by tomp »

dav_Oz wrote: post #80

If I look around me - and I'm more at the bottom, at grassheight relative to billionaires and UHNWI in general on skyscrapers - I see a host of other immediate "longevity issues". For one there is a substantial amount of people just trying get by and being like 50/50 on the choice of rather being dead already or trying to get through somehow 'till the next day, ad infinitum: from depressives who are stuck in a loop o…

Addressing the "wealth gap" sounds good but is ultimately misguided.

If you look 100 years back, Rockefeller was the richest man in history (and might still be...), yet 1 of his 5 children died in infancy of a bacterial disease. These days, such diseases are extremely rare for about 1bn people in the western world, all of whom are effectively wealthier than Rockefeller was.

Yes, you can "save" people from poverty by giving them money, but ultimately you're just condemning their children to the same fate (after your money runs out). The only real progress is technology. And billionaires spending on anti-aging is exactly the kind of technology that will immensely benefit billions of people in the future.

Re: NewLimit: a company built to extend human healthspan

#102

Post by tomp »

RichardHeart wrote: post #67

I raised $27M for longevity research (SENS.org). Summary of pro death arguments: Fairness Only rich people will get it. (No tech has ever done this.) Better to give money to the poor than science. (family, city, state, nation, has proven local investment beats foreign.) Bad for society Dead people make more room for new, other people. (consider going first.) Run out of resources (live people discover/extract/renew be…

> Dead people make more room for new, other people. (consider going first.)

Thank you for this snarky remark.

Every time I hear people arguing against having kids for reasons (overpopulation, bad for environment, pessimism about the future), I cannot help but think: "why doesn't that argument extend to the present generation - i.e. suicide?"

So far, the best answer I've gotten is equivalent to "suicide is bad" (a.k.a. "I have no good rational arguments but it makes me feel bad")

Re: NewLimit: a company built to extend human healthspan

#103

Post by tomp »

youngtaff wrote: post #61

We know how to make people live longer – provide them with good healthcare from cradle on, reduce pollution, help them out of poverty etc. Biggest problem with people living longer is the costs of supporting them increase dramatically, and who's going to pay these costs? Increasing longevity places a burden on our children, and their children

You're confusing (deliberately?) a few different things.

(1) better healthcare, reducing poverty etc. lift the floor of longevity but not the ceiling

(2) "cost of old age" is exactly what longevity research attempts to reduce - noone is interested in living longer as a vegetable; instead, the goal is to increase healthspan - living healthier for longer

Re: NewLimit: a company built to extend human healthspan

#104

Post by mrshadowgoose »

shafyy wrote: post #3

There is something dystopian, childish, naive, desperate, arrogant, sad and tragic about billionaires founding and funding longevity companies and projects. They think that they've got it all, but deep down there's still this gaping hole of meaninglessness. They can control evertything. Everything but death. If only they can find a way to live longer, maybe even a way to never die of natural causes, everything will b…

I don't see it as arrogance at all, I see it as being uniquely fortunate to be in a position where one can attempt to address a fundamental problem that affects most people.

I'm not a billionaire and have zero prospects of ever becoming one. Maybe this would also be considered arrogance, but I don't want to grow old and die. Neither do any of my friends or family. None of them are billionaires either.

Life is absolutely incredible. Humanity is on the brink of technological progress the likes of which we've never seen before, and I'd love to (selfishly) stick around to experience it. I also don't see anything noble or enjoyable in watching friends, family and other people slowly break down and eventually die. I'd hazard a guess that a lot of people share this opinion.

I sadly don't have the resources to direct activity against the scourge of aging and death, and can only hope that fortunately-resourced individuals decide to do so.

Re: NewLimit: a company built to extend human healthspan

#105

Post by hungryforcodes »

cheschire wrote: post #78
hungryforcodes wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok. But why would mass production of longevity treatment not be affordable. Maybe you live in the US -- this is pretty much the only place where the price of medicine and medical treatment is obscene. If longevity comes -- it will be affordable for $1000 once a year for as long as you like in some other part of the world. Or if you live in any other Western country, part of your universal medical plan.

Thanks, I updated my post. Gatekeeping comes in many forms, not just price.

OK! Alot of your other points I agree with actually :)

Re: NewLimit: a company built to extend human healthspan

#106

Post by samwillis »

morpheos137 wrote: post #99

Can somebody explain to me why do people fear death?

I fear not being there to provide for my kids and seeing them grow up. The opportunity to help them grow into better people than myself and watch what they do with their lives.

I think that’s a legitimate fear, and nothing to do with what happens next to me.

Re: NewLimit: a company built to extend human healthspan

#107

Post by mrshadowgoose »

morpheos137 wrote: post #99

Can somebody explain to me why do people fear death?

I don't fear it. I simply don't want to unwillingly die. Life is incredible, and I'd like to continue enjoying it on my schedule.

"Conscious entity doesn't want to die" should be justification enough for not wanting to die. However, it seems that just because we've lived with a naturally imposed expiry date for so long, we are expected to accept death after an arbitrarily imposed time limit.

I live in an artificial structure because I do not accept the natural outdoor conditions that my ancestors lived in.

I communicate with people around the world, using horrendously artificial means, because I refuse to accept the silly natural limitations of local auditory communication.

I choose to accept antibiotics for infections that would otherwise naturally kill or maim me.

And if I can, I will choose to opt-out of death, the greatest disease that afflicts all of us.

As an aside, I do fear the tragedy of the aging process, for both myself and other people, but although that's presently a tightly-coupled problem, I'm assuming we're strictly discussing death and not aging.

Re: NewLimit: a company built to extend human healthspan

#108

Post by cto_of_antifa »

tomp wrote: post #101
dav_Oz wrote: post #80

If I look around me - and I'm more at the bottom, at grassheight relative to billionaires and UHNWI in general on skyscrapers - I see a host of other immediate "longevity issues". For one there is a substantial amount of people just trying get by and being like 50/50 on the choice of rather being dead already or trying to get through somehow 'till the next day, ad infinitum: from depressives who are stuck in a loop o…

Addressing the "wealth gap" sounds good but is ultimately misguided. If you look 100 years back, Rockefeller was the richest man in history (and might still be...), yet 1 of his 5 children died in infancy of a bacterial disease. These days, such diseases are extremely rare for about 1bn people in the western world, all of whom are effectively wealthier than Rockefeller was. Yes, you can "save" people from poverty by…

Do you think that people dying in poverty in American cities share that opinion?

Re: NewLimit: a company built to extend human healthspan

#109

Post by jcrben »

newsbinator wrote: post #100
xyzzy_plugh wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most billionaires I know would rather leave behind a legacy in the form of charitable foundations, their work, and their families. Squandering their fortune in a vain attempt to extend their own lives is not a widely accepted choice. Most rich folks would rather preserve their fortune for their offspring or try to make the world a better place. Eventually many people, rich or not, notice that the younger generations…

There’s no better legacy than “stopped death and disease from tearing down your grandchildren’s generation and every generation after it.”

I agree with Elon Musk that immortality is actually not great, and would instead lead to a static dystopia. New generations need a chance to put their own stamp on the world.

Re: NewLimit: a company built to extend human healthspan

#110

Post by shafyy »

kiba wrote: post #64
shafyy wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Although I don't disagree, I think that's a very narrow way to look at it. I think it's more about the fear of dying than about actual death. If you just died tomorrow in your sleep, what would it matter? Assuming you didn't have a terminal illness or are of old age, you probably didn't fear immediate death. And you didn't suffer one bit. Sure, it would suck for your friends and family, but for you, it wouldn't matte…

It's different for everyone. I fear non-existence more than dying.

Why do you fear it? You didn't fear it the 14 bn years before you existed, did you?
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