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Tell HN: You can't add “no ads” in your Play Store app's title

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Re: Tell HN: You can't add “no ads” in your Play Store app's title

#151

Post by temeritatis »

bscphil wrote: post #145
NikolaNovak wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My simpler explanation is that putting "no ads" in title is meaningless and without proof and on its own unenforceable. As a consumer, honestly, as much as I want to rant against big companies and for small developers - yeah, I'm with Google on this one. Putting random unverified claims in title is bad. (concordantly, I fully support making "no ads" actual metadata searchable/filterable, as well as "Supports Controll…

It's worse than just meaningless, it's actively trying to get a bullshit SEO advantage, which is essentially zero-sum at best and makes things worse for users. If my app is named "CoolBrowser", the title on Google Play should not be "Better Browser than Chrome". If my app is named "SketchyVPN", the title on Google Play should not be "Netflix Region Locking Bypasser". At best, these are workarounds for the Play store'…

> why can't I filter out apps that aren't open source?

This is laughable. It's 2021 and we still can't to basic filtering in our app stores. Maybe google (and Apple) engineers only know SELECT, but haven't learned about WHERE yet? Yeah i know it's a little much to demand. I mean we only went to the moon like 52 years ago.

Re: Tell HN: You can't add “no ads” in your Play Store app's title

#152

Post by stevenicr »

temeritatis wrote: post #151
bscphil wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's worse than just meaningless, it's actively trying to get a bullshit SEO advantage, which is essentially zero-sum at best and makes things worse for users. If my app is named "CoolBrowser", the title on Google Play should not be "Better Browser than Chrome". If my app is named "SketchyVPN", the title on Google Play should not be "Netflix Region Locking Bypasser". At best, these are workarounds for the Play store'…

> why can't I filter out apps that aren't open source? This is laughable. It's 2021 and we still can't to basic filtering in our app stores. Maybe google (and Apple) engineers only know SELECT, but haven't learned about WHERE yet? Yeah i know it's a little much to demand. I mean we only went to the moon like 52 years ago.

I basically gave up using the play store since I could not find any way to search/find 'ad free' or 'tracking free' or 'open source' etc.

The very few apps I use from the play store are either ad free or offer a premium version to remove ads completely - it's the only thing I'll put on my phone.

Seems there is too big a conflict of interest for even basic phone functionality - apps with ads make the money tree keep raining.

One day my (paid for prem version) "timed / scheduled silence" app pushed ads out to all users on an update and I had quite the back and forth with them - they fixed it - but did not seem to care one iota that their full screen overlay ads would prevent a mom from answering here phone right away or other basic functions. - It was all about the money and they were going to maximize that.

All the while no incentive for google to make basic functions available in android or find-able in the play store. So little competition for the abusive, ad-ladden, add basic function to your phone parasites.

Glad to find f-droid at least, but I've given up on using my phone for as many things as it's capable of because the search and find is no-ad-hostile.

Re: Tell HN: You can't add “no ads” in your Play Store app's title

#153

Post by drusepth »

tyingq wrote: post #113
drusepth wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems pretty trivial to eventually add, compared to trying to enforce correctness on results from user-provided tags in titles. I'm a little surprised you can't search for "no ads" apps outside of e.g. Pass listings, but I'm really glad they're not defaulting to just a title text search and cluttered listings of Farming Simulator [NO ADS] [NO IAPS] [NO REFERRALS] [NO TIMEWAITS] [NO DLC].

It's not searchable for a reason. Ad free apps don't generate revenue for Google. So devs added it to the title. Google is now closing that loophole.

Given that they already highlight ad-free apps, prominently display ad-or-no-ad statuses at the top of every app detail page, curate specifically-ad-free lists of recommended apps, and use "ad-free" verbiage as a selling point to promote individual apps (as well as lists of recommended apps), I don't think it's fair to just jump to assuming Google's purposefully against making it easier to find ad-free apps.

I'm not even sure I'm convinced that ad-free apps don't generate revenue for Google, even ignoring the ad-free apps that DO generate revenue for Google through IAPs and other non-ad means.

Re: Tell HN: You can't add “no ads” in your Play Store app's title

#154

Post by loonster »

muzani wrote: post #150
bscphil wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's worse than just meaningless, it's actively trying to get a bullshit SEO advantage, which is essentially zero-sum at best and makes things worse for users. If my app is named "CoolBrowser", the title on Google Play should not be "Better Browser than Chrome". If my app is named "SketchyVPN", the title on Google Play should not be "Netflix Region Locking Bypasser". At best, these are workarounds for the Play store'…

It's because Play Store puts a lot of weight on title and very little in the short or long descriptions. For a company that is reputed to be the best in search, Play Store has terrible search policies. Look up "bypass netflix" and guess what pops up. Unfortunately it's the only way to SEO in the Play Store. The impact is so strong that I avoid branding now, it makes more sense to register your VPN company as "Region…

Its the same for Etsy sellers. My wife sells on Etsy and several (non-tech) people that she follows recommend making the title a short description. It's annoying. Yet she does it because it works.

Re: Tell HN: You can't add “no ads” in your Play Store app's title

#156

Post by asddubs »

stevenicr wrote: post #152
temeritatis wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> why can't I filter out apps that aren't open source? This is laughable. It's 2021 and we still can't to basic filtering in our app stores. Maybe google (and Apple) engineers only know SELECT, but haven't learned about WHERE yet? Yeah i know it's a little much to demand. I mean we only went to the moon like 52 years ago.

I basically gave up using the play store since I could not find any way to search/find 'ad free' or 'tracking free' or 'open source' etc. The very few apps I use from the play store are either ad free or offer a premium version to remove ads completely - it's the only thing I'll put on my phone. Seems there is too big a conflict of interest for even basic phone functionality - apps with ads make the money tree keep r…

with currently 2 exceptions, i only use apps from f-droid. I think I'll buy a pinephone one of these days to throw some dev time at it, we really need an alternative to ios and android

Re: Tell HN: You can't add “no ads” in your Play Store app's title

#157

Post by smorgusofborg »

NikolaNovak wrote: post #135
ChuckMcM wrote: post #83

I suspect this is to foreclose against a future option for Google to monetize ‘free’ content in the play store without compensating the developers much as they do people’s videos on Youtube. For those who aren’t aware, in the games industry the distributor has been in the role of adding DRM to games on the pretense that they are “protecting their interests and channels”. As the distributor, Google may feel empowered…

My simpler explanation is that putting "no ads" in title is meaningless and without proof and on its own unenforceable. As a consumer, honestly, as much as I want to rant against big companies and for small developers - yeah, I'm with Google on this one. Putting random unverified claims in title is bad. (concordantly, I fully support making "no ads" actual metadata searchable/filterable, as well as "Supports Controll…

Putting "no added sugar" on a product box isn't meaningless because there are legal reprucussions to fraud. If nothing is happening when games with "no ads" have ads then that is a criticism to bring to the regulators.

Re: Tell HN: You can't add “no ads” in your Play Store app's title

#158

Post by endisneigh »

smorgusofborg wrote: post #157
NikolaNovak wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My simpler explanation is that putting "no ads" in title is meaningless and without proof and on its own unenforceable. As a consumer, honestly, as much as I want to rant against big companies and for small developers - yeah, I'm with Google on this one. Putting random unverified claims in title is bad. (concordantly, I fully support making "no ads" actual metadata searchable/filterable, as well as "Supports Controll…

Putting "no added sugar" on a product box isn't meaningless because there are legal reprucussions to fraud. If nothing is happening when games with "no ads" have ads then that is a criticism to bring to the regulators.

No added sugar is something that can be objectively measured. What does "no ads" mean? No Google ads? No sponsored content? Nothing referencing paid products? No soliciting?

Re: Tell HN: You can't add “no ads” in your Play Store app's title

#159

Post by IshKebab »

voussoir wrote: post #142
IshKebab wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are there any third party search interfaces? Seems like it would be pretty easy to add automatic checking for ads.

Yes, Aurora Store provides a filter for this. https://f-droid.org/en/packages/com.aurora.store/ And someone else mentioned https://playsearch.kaki87.net/

That second one is great! Although I just did a search for "Music" and it only returned 4 results. I'm sure there's more than 4 ad-free music players.

Re: Tell HN: You can't add “no ads” in your Play Store app's title

#160

Post by smorgusofborg »

endisneigh wrote: post #158
smorgusofborg wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Putting "no added sugar" on a product box isn't meaningless because there are legal reprucussions to fraud. If nothing is happening when games with "no ads" have ads then that is a criticism to bring to the regulators.

No added sugar is something that can be objectively measured. What does "no ads" mean? No Google ads? No sponsored content? Nothing referencing paid products? No soliciting?

Yes, this time it is digital so it's hopeless and since someone may get into a long dispute over product placements, every app should be equally likely to be bringing in protocols that are purely for ads. The only solution is to let the distributor just remove all information that might inform our decisions.

Here is the FDA's rules for the term "lite":

https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cdrh/cfdocs/cfcfr/CFR...

Certainly not perfect, but better than if the next time a product at whole foods gets caught in a fraud we let Amazon remark everything as "food".

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