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How do you fix a stroad?

strongtowns.org

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Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#81

Post by Tostino »

jimmaswell wrote: post #19
throw0101a wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except streets and roads are designed to solve different problems: > Streets: The function of a street is to serve as a platform for building wealth. On a street, we're attempting to grow the complex ecosystem that produces community wealth. In these environments, people (outside of their automobiles) are the indicator species of success. Successful streets are environments where humans, and human interaction, flouri…

I've seen the video, it just didn't resonate much. I drive those areas often enough without issue. I've walked through them too. They feel like an acceptable compromise for the most part but they could do with protected bike lanes and flashing crossings like I mentioned.

This is such a limited perspective. I've been in 200+ different towns over the past few years in the US with my RV. Using either our car (if we brought it with), walking, bikes, or scooters. It's amazing how horrible some rural places are for pedestrian or bike/scooter traffic. No way to get from where we are staying without hitting roads with no pedestrian paths at all and 40+mph (~64+kph) speed limits. When in the RV for months long trips, we don't have the car with us most of the time, so I've come to hate these designs that make no overtures to people not wanting to drive absolutely everywhere. They are just flat out hostile.

When we do find an area that has well designed ways to navigate, it's just more enjoyable and I want to go out and see what the area has to offer.

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#82

Post by bee_rider »

saghm wrote: post #61
bee_rider wrote: post #46

"Stroad" seems to be a recently popularized by strongtowns. I'm curious if anyone has actually managed to measure this sort of thing? My suspicion is that it "stroads" are essentially to-wide streets, and it should be possible to find research indicating that streets should be narrower, because widening them causes people to drive too fast. I was only able to find the following, coverage, though: https://usa.streetsb…

> "Stroad" seems to be a new made-up word by strongtowns Thank you! I clicked the link and then scrolled through several top-level comments thinking that either this was some sort of internet joke that I wasn't previously aware of or I somehow managed to not learn word that everyone else has always known.

It looks like they came up with it in 2013 actually, I've only recently bumped into it (and suddenly, multiple times). I think it might be in the process of becoming a thing for... I dunno, there's a particular group of people online who get really into very specific policy things and kind of meme about them, but also kind of try and make solid arguments for them.

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#83

Post by aeharding »

bee_rider wrote: post #46

"Stroad" seems to be a recently popularized by strongtowns. I'm curious if anyone has actually managed to measure this sort of thing? My suspicion is that it "stroads" are essentially to-wide streets, and it should be possible to find research indicating that streets should be narrower, because widening them causes people to drive too fast. I was only able to find the following, coverage, though: https://usa.streetsb…

It's definitely a word coined by Strong Towns. But, a "new" made up word? I guess it depends on your scale of "new."

The oldest reference to "Stroad" on strongtowns.org I've found is this[1] from January 2, 2012.

That makes the term nearly 10 years old. That being said, this term has been getting much more popular over the last couple years, especially due to Not Just Bikes.

[1] https://www.strongtowns.org/journal/2012/1/2/the-cost-of-aut...

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#84

Post by mperham »

alanbernstein wrote: post #62
JetAlone wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anti-stroadism is a deluded locus of control for detached intellectuals that will lead us into the fresh horrors of a dark age yet unseen. Without the strong stroadlandians to remind us of the importance of danger and adversity, we would have small walking communities of sensitive, dependent pedestrians who gradually get cut off from one another as the roads fall into disrepair.

The point is that we're already in a dark age, brought about by transforming the environment to work for cars instead of humans.

Wow, this is bleak but true.

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#85

Post by JetAlone »

alanbernstein wrote: post #62
JetAlone wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anti-stroadism is a deluded locus of control for detached intellectuals that will lead us into the fresh horrors of a dark age yet unseen. Without the strong stroadlandians to remind us of the importance of danger and adversity, we would have small walking communities of sensitive, dependent pedestrians who gradually get cut off from one another as the roads fall into disrepair.

The point is that we're already in a dark age, brought about by transforming the environment to work for cars instead of humans.

Stroadlandia is a noble, and beautiful place. Her cars are majestic creatures, worthy of human service. Her department stores and parking lots overflow with the abundance of a multifaceted thoroughfare that defies the reason of mortal man.

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#86

Post by sokoloff »

jcranmer wrote: post #55
josephcsible wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> such that most people don't need to drive I disagree that they'll accomplish this for most people. In particular, what about all of the people who live in suburbs but work in the city?

Bus systems can work well to move commuters to rail-based mass-transit that bring them into the city. If the suburbs sprawl too far out, you can also plop down park-and-rides at the terminal stations of the mass transit system. Why do you specifically need to drive and park at the exact location you're going to, especially when the land cost of the storage place of your empty car is prohibitively expensive (as they t…

I have no need to park my car at any particular place. I do have a need to have the commuting experience be safe, reasonably convenient/predictable, and time-efficient.

I live in Cambridge on the Boston subway system. It’s probably (barely) in the top 5 in the US and it sucks compared to European cities I’ve visited or lived in.

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#87

Post by bee_rider »

aeharding wrote: post #83
bee_rider wrote: post #46

"Stroad" seems to be a recently popularized by strongtowns. I'm curious if anyone has actually managed to measure this sort of thing? My suspicion is that it "stroads" are essentially to-wide streets, and it should be possible to find research indicating that streets should be narrower, because widening them causes people to drive too fast. I was only able to find the following, coverage, though: https://usa.streetsb…

It's definitely a word coined by Strong Towns. But, a "new" made up word? I guess it depends on your scale of "new." The oldest reference to "Stroad" on strongtowns.org I've found is this[1] from January 2, 2012. That makes the term nearly 10 years old. That being said, this term has been getting much more popular over the last couple years, especially due to Not Just Bikes. [1] https://www.strongtowns.org/journal/20…

Yeah, I edited that because it looked unintentionally dismissive (fwiw I think it is a great term). I think it is just blowing up now.

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#88

Post by wilkommen »

wilkommen wrote: post #78
_dain_ wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Who "wins" when we shift our building patterns towards Urbanism? Aside from everyone who gets to live there, of course. I feel like big political changes like this don't happen unless someone who stands to gain is busy lobbying to make it happen. And I don't know what, if any, entity stands to gain a lot from building pedestrian-friendly, dense, beautiful cities. You may be interested in a policy the UK government i…

From that proposal: "The housing crisis is often presented as a zero-sum conflict. More houses must be built to avoid rising homelessness, falling home ownership, and wider economic stagnation. But they can only be built by forcing them through against the will of local people, either by imposing high-rise on our historic centres, or by concreting over our countryside with more suburban housing estates. On this analy…

The more I read of this proposal the more I like it. It feels realistic. I feel like it properly addresses the reasons people oppose development and offers a practical way out of the bind.

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#89

Post by ReaLNero »

trinovantes wrote: post #75

The Not Just Bikes youtube channel was quite the rabbit hole. It has convinced me that I really hate North American car-centric cities. It's a shame there's basically no country in the anglosphere designed for pedestrians like most European countries.

If you draw the line at country, sure. But America is huge compared to European nation-states.

NYC is very public transportation-oriented. The Northeast corridor Amtrak line also is a big boon!

Re: How do you fix a stroad?

#90

Post by ocdtrekkie »

pcmoney wrote: post #49
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #34

As a fun note, I immediately recognized the location of this stroad pictured. I live relatively close to it. There's been a lot of new development there recently. They just redeveloped a large chunk of the area including launching a major Costco and an Amazon Fresh. I would honestly say it's a pretty healthy travel thoroughfare. It gets backed up during rush hour, but even interstates do here, so that's not unusual.

How is it walking or biking? Or is it only healthy if you’re in a couple thousand pound armored living room on wheels?

So as a suburban area, it is generally not optimized for biking as a mode of transportation. Suburbs absolutely cater to cars, and this road is no exception. There are significant and wide-reaching bike trails across the surrounding county, but if you're going to and from work in the area, you have a car, almost exclusively.

The very nature of the fact that very little of the surrounding area caters to pedestrian traffic, the road would do a bad job if it was optimized for that.

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