Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Apple CEO Tim Cook 'secretly' signed $275B deal with China in 2016

macrumors.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

101–110 of 755 posts

Re: Apple CEO Tim Cook 'secretly' signed $275B deal with China in 2016

#101

Post by inasio »

mhoad wrote: post #37
inasio wrote: post #25

Disregarding the human rights/politics background, this sounds like standard operating procedure for Apple: Do whatever it takes to have unimpeded access to the best tools/tech needed for their mission

Except no, you shouldn’t just disregard the human rights / politics in search of “the best tools” which happens to be low waged workers who were famously killings themselves at work in such large numbers that their solution was to install nets so that they wouldn’t die when jumping out the windows anymore,

I didn't mean to imply that you should disregard human rights, only that when you look at it from a strictly strategic point of view, it aligns with the strategy that Apple follows in many other areas. See for example buying full chip lines, entire display supply, even for the gigantic windows they use at the Apple stores.

Re: Apple CEO Tim Cook 'secretly' signed $275B deal with China in 2016

#102

Post by kelnos »

qeternity wrote: post #73
ipv6ipv4 wrote: post #50

Daring Fireball [1] has another passage from the article which is illuminating with regards to any promises Apple makes about how it will resist governmental pressure to compromise its products, vis-à-vis Apple's CSAM scanning tool. "Sometime in 2014 or early 2015, China’s State Bureau of Surveying and Mapping told members of the Apple Maps team to make the Diaoyu Islands, the objects of a long-running territorial di…

I totally get that people want companies to act with dignity, but the idea that a company, even one as large as Apple, is going to make any sort of difference with respect to China's oddities is wishful thinking. Apple has a business to run. They abide by all sorts of requests in various countries in which they operate. Of course there has to be a line somewhere, I'm just not sure this is it.

I know this would never happen, but I wish companies would just default to not doing business in China, unless they are able to sell their product, uncompromised. I wouldn't mind legislation to that effect, though I'm sure that would come with a ton of unintended consequences.

If China (and similar repressive regimes) wants these sorts of products with onerous restrictions built in, they should have to build them themselves.

Of course, I do recognize that this is perhaps somewhat hypocritical: the OFAC list in the US comes to mind (which makes it illegal for US entities to do business with entities in certain "bad" countries). I'm reminded of GitHub's fight to allow people from Iran to use GitHub. I get the purpose of sanctions on Iran, but hurting regular Iranian citizens with these sorts of bans does nothing to punish or put pressure on the people who are actually the targets of sanctions.

Re: Apple CEO Tim Cook 'secretly' signed $275B deal with China in 2016

#103

Post by makapuf »

mullingitover wrote: post #97
arcticbull wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ... seeking to merge with other democratic nations (Australia, Korea, Japan, Taiwan). That presumes that other countries want to be part of America. I suspect strongly you'll find that's not the case. Merger then has a more "1812" feeling to it. The only folks tripping over their shoelaces to be US states are Puerto Rico and DC. > America needs to onshore manufacturing of critical chemicals and components. Steel. E…

> That presumes that other countries want to be part of America. I feel like if there was a referendum, the UK's population would happily dump their monarchy in exchange for US statehood. There's a lot of commonality with their democracy, language, skepticism of foreign immigration, embrace of capitalism, etc. It would also be a pretty solid strategic move to bring the US closer to Europe as a hedge against the Russi…

UK dumped EU, which didn't asked for country dissolution, not sure it would agree to join USA...

Re: Apple CEO Tim Cook 'secretly' signed $275B deal with China in 2016

#104

Post by Barrin92 »

justinator wrote: post #46
mempko wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China simply invested more in their people than USA it seems. You now see American business people like Elon Musk promote divestment from the USA in his attack on government deficits.

> China simply invested more in their people than USA it seems So long as you're not Muslim.

that this is an extreme oversimplification of the Xinjiang issue should be obvious given the fact that other Muslim Chinese minorities like the Hui in China enjoy relative religious freedom. (in fact the issue is assimilation into China's ruling class, not religion per se). In fact inter-Muslim wars in China itself have a long history between different Islamic groups. Also of course the (lack of) response from the Muslim world in general to the Uyghur situation should make clear that the situation is somewhat more complicated.

Re: Apple CEO Tim Cook 'secretly' signed $275B deal with China in 2016

#105

Post by onepointsixC »

justicezyx wrote: post #91
poutine wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no moral equivalency between the US and China. Stop this right away.

What do you mean no moral equivalency? Are you suggesting one is obviously superior than the other? Judging the behaviors in the 21st century, I think China is morally superior to US? Based on the wars invoked by IS, and the poverty elimination done by China. Obviously China improved Chinese citizens living standard dramatically, while US are doing the opposite across the world.

[flagged]

Re: Apple CEO Tim Cook 'secretly' signed $275B deal with China in 2016

#106

Post by onepointsixC »

makeitdouble wrote: post #3
moogly wrote: post #2

At what point does something like this become a national security issue? I know these modern titans of industry answer to no one, but perhaps they should?

I find it interesting you see Apple a national asset needing special scrutiny. It might as well be true, but then you should also expect other countries to start dealing with Apple as a part of the US gov. and not a purely private party.

Of course it needs special scrutiny. What if in the midst of a break down in talks between the US and China, Chinese regulators come calling and say that either Apple provides the iCloud backup data of a staffer of an America senator or else they will be immediately banned from the Chinese market.

Re: Apple CEO Tim Cook 'secretly' signed $275B deal with China in 2016

#107

Post by tiffanyh »

Everyone new this back in 2016.

On May 16, 2016 - China blocked Apple iTunes, Movies, etc [0].

On the same date, Apple invested $1B in Didi (Chinese “Uber”) [1] and magically China unblock Apple.

So what’s new in this story?

[0] https://amp.scmp.com/tech/leaders-founders/article/1945616/a...

[1] https://mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKCN0Y404W

Re: Apple CEO Tim Cook 'secretly' signed $275B deal with China in 2016

#108

Post by onepointsixC »

sneak wrote: post #100
pupppet wrote: post #27

This will be the logical conclusion to every major American corporation unless someone puts a stop to this. If profit comes before everything, then so will China's 1.4B potential market vs US's 330M market.

You are forgetting about manufacturing. While China is indeed an important and huge market for sales... approximately 100% of Apple's products are manufactured in China (save some tiny fraction that are assembled in India or Texas). Every iPhone sold everywhere worldwide (except the few assembled in India) comes from China. Apple cannot exist without China. Full stop.

That's completely wrong. How is it that one of their largest global competitors, Samsung, exists despite having no factories in China for years now? Apple could leave China just fine as far as manufacturing is concerned. The question is would it be able to still sell to the Chinese market if it does.

Re: Apple CEO Tim Cook 'secretly' signed $275B deal with China in 2016

#110

Post by rodneyzeng »

Yeah, China is taking advantage of US companies, state governments, to compete with USA. There are lots of company leaders and governors can benefit from secrete negotiations with China government. There is only one China, but there are tons of American businesses.
Post reply on HN