OS X Lion: Apple’s Vista moment • Hacker News Board

Re: OS X Lion: Apple’s Vista moment

#31

Post by dgallagher » Wed, Aug 31, 2011, 2:48 PM UTC

When 10.5.0 Leopard came out an replaced 10.4.x Tiger, it was quite buggy until around 10.5.3. Aside from Snow Leopard which was a special case, new OS X releases are typically buggy for the first few months.

Vista was a dog because it was slow, resource intensive, and Microsoft never issued any updates to fix it.

The only thing I thought was a bad idea in Lion was Time Machine snapshotting your local HD every hour, to itself, when your backup drive isn't available (like on a laptop). That would kill I/O whenever it ran, slowing everything. Shutting that off fixed 90% of the problems I had.

Re: OS X Lion: Apple’s Vista moment

#32

Post by batiudrami » Wed, Aug 31, 2011, 2:49 PM UTC

I don't know what this guy does to his computers, but considering his Windows claims (I maintain that Vista was a significant improvement over XP, with some very poor publicity), I find it hard to believe his Lion experiences are typical.

Re: OS X Lion: Apple’s Vista moment

#33

Post by tseabrooks » Wed, Aug 31, 2011, 2:51 PM UTC

johnthedebs wrote: post #25

tseabrooks wrote: post #12

I'm pretty disappointed with Lion. Though, I don't see the problems this guy mentions... There are wireless problem on my iMac.. even after the update to fix the wifi problems... but I'm most disappointed with the complete "FU" Lion gives to multi-monitor support... using mission control is really really painful in a multi-monitor setup. Not to mention I don't actually get to use the new fullscreen apps because Apple…

why else would these blatant multi-monitor issues exist if not to intentionally hurt me? I'm using Lion with multiple monitors, too, and have been annoyed by this. But the company that sells https://www.apple.com/displays/ definitely didn't do this to intentionally hurt users with multiple monitors. My assumption is that, because of the dramatic changes to the desktop workflow in Lion, they needed to cut some feature…

Hah! I don't actually believe it was to "hurt" anyone, It was just a bit of hyperbole. I do, however, think that Apple's vision for the future of desktop computing is sans multiple monitors.

Re: OS X Lion: Apple’s Vista moment

#34

Post by rbanffy » Wed, Aug 31, 2011, 2:51 PM UTC

Has this guy ever used Windows Vista?! I agree Lion is a bit underwhelming, but that's nowhere near the disappointment (Microsoft did promise a lot at PDC 2003) users had when Vista actually showed up years after schedule, bloated, slow and ugly.

BTW, his crashes may be hardware (memory) related. I'd advise him to run memtest or to take his Mac to the nearest Apple store to have it checked.

Re: OS X Lion: Apple’s Vista moment

#35

Post by uptown » Wed, Aug 31, 2011, 2:52 PM UTC

bsiemon wrote: post #23

uptown wrote: post #21

My personal Lion problems have been Chrome and TweetDeck. 1) Chrome crashes all the time to the point of almost being unusable. I've tried removing extensions, and Flash and it doesn't seem to matter. I also have a problem where typing in Chrome's address bar is like typing in molasses. Each letter take about a second to appear. This problem started after my upgrade to Lion. 2) TweetDeck seems to throw the entire win…

I am on the chrome dev channel and have had zero problems. Hope this helps.

Thanks. I'll give it a try.

Re: OS X Lion: Apple’s Vista moment

#36

Post by kenjackson » Wed, Aug 31, 2011, 2:52 PM UTC

What is up with GarageBand? This thing wants to near peg CPU often. I thought it was just my sister's config. But then I hear on the This Is My Next podcast that Josh Topolsky is having the same problem. And Nilay says he's not having a problem as its using 13% of CPU ... on an 8-core system. It totally brings the system to its knees.

Re: OS X Lion: Apple’s Vista moment

#37

Post by dadro » Wed, Aug 31, 2011, 2:53 PM UTC

Lion is not Vista. Vista (IMHO) had a rotten core where as Lion doesn't. There are, however, issues that I suspect will be fully resolved via another update or two.

When I upgraded to Lion I experienced a few minor stability issues (particularly with Finder) so I performed a clean install. Have had no issues since. I would be curious to see stability of a machine that has been upgraded from 10.5 -> 10.6 -> 10.7 vs one that has simply had a clean install of 10.7.

[EDIT as I got downvoted presumably for knocking on Vista]

Vista shipped with the version 6.0 kernel. This was known to be a fragmented, "consumer grade" kernel largely based on Win XP. The 6000 kernel build had so many issues that SP1 completely upgraded the kernel to the improved 6.0.6001 which was essentially the Server 2k8 kernel. It was an improvement but too little, to late.

Re: OS X Lion: Apple’s Vista moment

#38

Post by PatrickTulskie » Wed, Aug 31, 2011, 2:53 PM UTC

dgallagher wrote: post #31

When 10.5.0 Leopard came out an replaced 10.4.x Tiger, it was quite buggy until around 10.5.3. Aside from Snow Leopard which was a special case, new OS X releases are typically buggy for the first few months. Vista was a dog because it was slow, resource intensive, and Microsoft never issued any updates to fix it. The only thing I thought was a bad idea in Lion was Time Machine snapshotting your local HD every hour,…

I never really had any issues with Time Machine snapshotting when I don't have my external drive attached. It's worked pretty well for me.

I had a lot of problems when I first installed Lion, but I also had a lot of crap installed on my machine. I did a fresh install of Lion and everything is great. I don't have any of the problems described in the article and I didn't really have many to begin with.

Comparing Vista with Lion is dumb and the article reads as though the author knows it but decided to stick with the idea so that they could get some traffic for their dumb article title.

Re: OS X Lion: Apple’s Vista moment

#39

Post by jonpaul » Wed, Aug 31, 2011, 2:54 PM UTC

dgallagher wrote: post #31

When 10.5.0 Leopard came out an replaced 10.4.x Tiger, it was quite buggy until around 10.5.3. Aside from Snow Leopard which was a special case, new OS X releases are typically buggy for the first few months. Vista was a dog because it was slow, resource intensive, and Microsoft never issued any updates to fix it. The only thing I thought was a bad idea in Lion was Time Machine snapshotting your local HD every hour,…

Might I ask, how did you shut that off? I don't see any configuration option in the System Preferences - Time Machine about snapshotting every hour. Thanks.

Re: OS X Lion: Apple’s Vista moment

#40

Post by masklinn » Wed, Aug 31, 2011, 2:58 PM UTC

tseabrooks wrote: post #33

johnthedebs wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

why else would these blatant multi-monitor issues exist if not to intentionally hurt me? I'm using Lion with multiple monitors, too, and have been annoyed by this. But the company that sells https://www.apple.com/displays/ definitely didn't do this to intentionally hurt users with multiple monitors. My assumption is that, because of the dramatic changes to the desktop workflow in Lion, they needed to cut some feature…

Hah! I don't actually believe it was to "hurt" anyone, It was just a bit of hyperbole. I do, however, think that Apple's vision for the future of desktop computing is sans multiple monitors.

> I do, however, think that Apple's vision for the future of desktop computing is sans multiple monitors.

Which is very weird considering their Thunderbolt monitor is specifically marketed for use with their laptops, and for chainability (so not just 2 monitors but at least 3).