Live data from Hacker News

Boox Mira Pro – 25.3" E Ink Monitor

shop.boox.com

251–260 of 266 posts

Re: Boox Mira Pro – 25.3" E Ink Monitor

#251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't speak to e-ink but regarding screen time addiction, I used Gray-Switch ( https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.vegardit.g... ) to turn my phone display black and white, and immediately my phone use decreased by 66%.

I do this too on my iPhone - like all the really good iPhone settings, it’s an accessibility option, under Display -> Color Filters. You can also set up the “accessibility shortcut” so triple-clicking the side button enables or disables it. It really reduces the intensity of the phone - you never realize just how garish the color choices are for almost every app out there until you see it in B&W.

This is a genius idea, I'm trying it out now. Had an iPhone for years and never had a clue about this feature. Thank you.

Re: Boox Mira Pro – 25.3" E Ink Monitor

#252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many developers and authors have a workflow that doesn't include a GUI with a pointer? I for one would not like to go back to terminal-only. There's a lot to be gained from decent graphical interfaces, and having them smooth makes working on them more pleasing, which reduces my stress and allows me to be more productive.

LCDs of the 1990s had ghosting, and this was solved with pointer trails and other accessibility features, like disabling animations. People should be able to make the choice of outdoor visibility versus update smoothness.

Outdoor visibility can be solved with a brighter screen.

I have worked under bright summer sunlight on my Air whose screen is 400 nits. It was not comfortable but it was workable. The M1(Max|Pro) laptops are "up to 1000 nits sustained (full-screen) brightness, 1600 nits peak brightness". Surely that would work well enough outside, although I haven't tried it.

No amount of trickery like pointer trails will make up for the fact that the pointer lags behind the input by a very noticeable amount. It's like trying to play a musical instrument with 200ms latency. You'll get distracted and lose your tempo and timing. Or at least I would, and I suspect the vast majority of computer users, pro or otherwise, would as well. This should again answer the original question:

> how there isn't a market for a work _laptop_ with a display like this?

Re: Boox Mira Pro – 25.3" E Ink Monitor

#253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No one is going to sell a device that costs significantly more than any other for the same power to provide what 99% of users would consider a sub par/ unusable display. Like seriously can you imagine trying to sell a laptop that is unable to watch any media, play any games and has the refresh rate / perceived performance of a 15 year old tablet. This stuff isn't ready to be a 'main' display yet.

What if they made the display modular, so that you could swap it with a regular display for when you want to do gaming and other stuff like that? I personally would buy an e-ink laptop, but then again I'm very much into e-ink, I have a Kindle and ReMarkable 2, years ago I also bought DPT-S1 but I returned it because it was too expensive. Also colour e-ink displays have been getting better and better too! So I'm sure…

The modularity of the Framework laptop comes to mind, maybe one day, we’ll see.

Re: Boox Mira Pro – 25.3" E Ink Monitor

#254
post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can it talk to my laptop via bluetooth? That would be rad. I'd use it outdoors, with my laptop running but still folded in my bag.

In what way? It’s got Bluetooth and can do anything an android device can :) If there’s something specific you have in mind I can give it a try?

Yes please! I just want to know if such a screen can serve as the UI (including touch input from the user) for a laptop that's folded and put away somewhere nearby.

Re: Boox Mira Pro – 25.3" E Ink Monitor

#255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm idly curious about the word processor you put together. You're not saying "text editor", which suggests some level of interesting/novel functionality.

Exactly: full fledged Word Processor, optimized for the contextual technology of a ~13'' EPD display (so, for example, no scrolling, corner-to-corner (but the margins) use of the display in two columns landscape - for use with a slotted BT keyboard). Native Java for Android (no need for NDK). Rich text and full paragraph justification, spacing and indenting - from scratch: text is rendered and placed on the bitmap of…

Oooo.

Wow, this sounds awesome.

I hadn't thought of the concept of writing into a multiple-column layout before. That's really really neat. It keeps the individual runs of text short (faster for proofreading, I've heard), scrolls less, and lets you keep more context on the screen.

I'm definitely very interested in this when it comes out, I don't currently have a tablet-size device but that probably won't be the case for too long and I can see myself giving this a go. A single-column option for phones (in landscape mode) might be practical.

I do completely agree that Android feels structurally broken (for want of a better way to put it) in terms of application support - it honestly feels like someone figured out how to bolt WebKit onto a feature phone and add capacitive touch and eye candy, while (somehow???) maintaining the same "smol device" fundamentals of "toy" and "not full PC". IMHO the PC experience isn't really one single cohesive vision, but rather the emergent result of years of many thousands of little independently-evolved self-sustaining threads and ideas (particularly in UX design) intersecting and bouncing off each other in a sort of cohesive balance that resulted in (comparative) miracles like Windows XP. Microsoft et al didn't invent the fundamentals of the ideology and language that emerged; rather, they just figured out how to capitalize on the net result and realized that if they knee-capped it too heavily they'd kill the thing they were trying to benefit off of.

From a distance it kinda looks like Apple/Google are trying to (re)invent everything - conventions, expectations, design language, (tens of?) thousands of tiny details, etc - from first principles, without giving sufficient consideration to whether their fussing about accidentally edits and rewrites the technological aspects of the goal narrative. I think advertising and the exponential over-valuation of user data are to blame for the current insanity - and sadly so, since it's obvious that won't change soon. I think the fundamental incentive to refine and optimize for technical experience/competence has become diluted by All The Ad Revenue™ from the current status quo, producing the current ecosystem, app store offerings, app quality level, fragmentation, etc. Basically everything seems to be working as intended, or in other words I don't mean that "current status quo is fundamentally bad and evil" (for want of a better way to put it), I rather mean that between ad revenue, internal politicking, Google/Apple/Microsoft competition, antitrust regulations, overall public perception of how invasive ads/tracking is, etc etc, the system as a whole has basically reached a steady state that simply doesn't have room for pure technical excellence, which I don't think will change until the ad bubble collapses. I'm tentatively hopeful that might actually happen in my lifetime, although as a counterpoint, hopefully it doesn't take so long the world ends up in a WALL•E-style dystopia with everything paperclip-maximized around ads instead of garbage. Haha.

However, this all provides a unique opportunity for anyone prepared to make the effort to make apps that are actually interesting: can I interest you in a "Buy" button? :P

You mentioned cleaning up the source code - and while I certainly won't dissuade you from open-sourcing something like this :D (it would be a genuine net improvement, and you could list on F-Droid as well), I'm reminded of the "source code is on GitHub, but ready-to-go APK in Play Store is $.$$" model, which I think could work quite well for this sort of thing. There are a lot of small, focused apps out there that have loyal followings.

Maybe you could do an "early beta" sort of thing to cue users to understand the first versions are free but you plan to change that at some point. (The Play Store management dashboards probably make it straightforward to grandfather everyone who started with the beta into free updates for life or something like that.)

Re: Boox Mira Pro – 25.3" E Ink Monitor

#256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

LCDs of the 1990s had ghosting, and this was solved with pointer trails and other accessibility features, like disabling animations. People should be able to make the choice of outdoor visibility versus update smoothness.

Outdoor visibility can be solved with a brighter screen. I have worked under bright summer sunlight on my Air whose screen is 400 nits. It was not comfortable but it was workable. The M1(Max|Pro) laptops are "up to 1000 nits sustained (full-screen) brightness, 1600 nits peak brightness". Surely that would work well enough outside, although I haven't tried it. No amount of trickery like pointer trails will make up for…

Outdoor visibility can be solved with a brighter screen.

To an extent, but eye strain is reduced quite a bit when surfaces are front-lit by the environment rather than back-lit by a uniform light.

No amount of trickery like pointer trails will make up for the fact that the pointer lags behind the input by a very noticeable amount.

As I understand it, small parts of an e-ink screen can be updated very quickly, but sacrificing grayscale accuracy and glitchiness. Either way, I'd 100% buy an e-ink laptop with specs comparable to current developer laptops, so how many people does it take to make a market for that?

Re: Boox Mira Pro – 25.3" E Ink Monitor

#257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Outdoor visibility can be solved with a brighter screen. I have worked under bright summer sunlight on my Air whose screen is 400 nits. It was not comfortable but it was workable. The M1(Max|Pro) laptops are "up to 1000 nits sustained (full-screen) brightness, 1600 nits peak brightness". Surely that would work well enough outside, although I haven't tried it. No amount of trickery like pointer trails will make up for…

Outdoor visibility can be solved with a brighter screen. To an extent, but eye strain is reduced quite a bit when surfaces are front-lit by the environment rather than back-lit by a uniform light. No amount of trickery like pointer trails will make up for the fact that the pointer lags behind the input by a very noticeable amount. As I understand it, small parts of an e-ink screen can be updated very quickly, but sac…

Fair points, and I'd love to find that out. Perhaps start lobbying with one of the existing laptop manufacturers? They might do some market research to understand if there is an actual market for it.

> I'd 100% buy an e-ink laptop > how many people does it take to make a market for that?

I honestly have no idea but my guess is, more than one. Probably _a lot_ more. Not only the company would need to sell the first batch but they'd have to keep improving on it, selling more and getting them replaced constantly, otherwise it would become vapourware after the first (few) iterations. If the first iteration is not great, at least some users will hold off and think twice about getting the second. If it's not good enough for a lot of the users, I suspect it would go totally bust after the second iteration.

It's not just the cost of the hardware either, they would likely need to solve drivers, and if it's going to be a dev laptop, they'd at least need to support both Linux and Windows. This is no small feat.

Sure, they could try to offload drivers and software to the display manufacturer, but now you'd have to prove to them that there's a market worth pursuing as well.

Re: Boox Mira Pro – 25.3" E Ink Monitor

#258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

where would the settings for that be? accessibility?

On my phone it's Settings => Display => LiveDisplay => Reading mode ("Grayscale mode for long-term reading"). I can also add a reading mode toggle button to the quick settings in the notification bar. The search box in Settings will probably find it if you search for gray or reading. This is on LineageOS 18 (Android 11), though I recall it being mentioned in some Google events/announcements so I'm 99% sure it's a cor…

thanks

Re: Boox Mira Pro – 25.3" E Ink Monitor

#259
post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In what way? It’s got Bluetooth and can do anything an android device can :) If there’s something specific you have in mind I can give it a try?

Yes please! I just want to know if such a screen can serve as the UI (including touch input from the user) for a laptop that's folded and put away somewhere nearby.

Ah! I'll have a look and see what Android apps will do that, if any, and give it a try! Send me an email (in my profile) and I'll let you know how I go in the next day or two?

It's 100% possible though:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uaEnd4VzYZM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0k4HHOe56K8

And these are both older devices with older software. That Deep Guide one is the best demonstration!

A comment on that video is relevant:

> just tried and it works perfectly on my note2. The good thing I just realised is that you can use the touch screen to control as a mouse on note2, which makes the experience even better!

Supports touch/keyboard input too; and on the Note 2 :)

Post reply on HN