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Microsoft’s new Windows prompts try to stop people downloading Chrome

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Re: Microsoft’s new Windows prompts try to stop people downloading Chrome

#371

Post by jeroenhd »

coolso wrote: post #233
jeroenhd wrote: post #190

Back when Edgeium was new and just Chrome but with a lot of Google cruft removed, I actually used Edge instead of Chrome when I was on Windows. It was the same browser with some additional tweaks that I quite liked. Then Microsoft started this aggressive, disruptive push to bring it to iOS Safari's level as the only browser people should use. I don't know any good operating systems for normal people anymore. Windows…

> Then Microsoft started this aggressive, disruptive push to bring it to iOS Safari's level as the only browser people should use. Counter-point: my dislike of Edge aside (especially since it uses Chromium instead of their own engine, which is lame), Google has made an aggressive, disruptive push to switch people to Chrome for many years now, which itself has made some aggressive, disruptive effects on the web. Is a…

> May I ask what makes you think this?

Windows blatantly ignores your preferences and settings to push Microsoft's own products. It started with little popups about Edge and previews of Microsoft Office, but every month the intrusive crap gets worse. Now computers come with some kind of debt scam installed by default into the browser that is VERY hard to get out of without technical knowledge or the help of someone with it.

Firefox had to reverse engineer Microsoft's system twice now to simply allow setting a browser as a default, and Microsoft has said to "patch out" their latest approach. Even still, the default browser won't open when you accidentally click a link to Microsoft's help; that opens in an ms-edge link that Microsoft keeps strictly to themselves. I consider that to be hostile.

Re: Microsoft’s new Windows prompts try to stop people downloading Chrome

#372

Post by jeroenhd »

overshadow wrote: post #306
jeroenhd wrote: post #190

Back when Edgeium was new and just Chrome but with a lot of Google cruft removed, I actually used Edge instead of Chrome when I was on Windows. It was the same browser with some additional tweaks that I quite liked. Then Microsoft started this aggressive, disruptive push to bring it to iOS Safari's level as the only browser people should use. I don't know any good operating systems for normal people anymore. Windows…

> Linux has been making progress but still isn't a good alternative for the common user For non tech savvy people, Linux can cause problems, but only if they do something weird to their system. Linux, specifically Ubuntu or Mint, untouched, and unaltered is a great out-of-the-box experience. The key (if turning someone on to Linux for the first time) is to stress that the command line is for power users who want full…

I agree, but when you Google "Ubuntu 21 sound not working" you end up here https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SoundTroubleshootingProced... and the first thing you see is tons of shell commands and very outdated GUI controls. This is the vendor documentation, not even a StackExchange forum.

When you Google for "Windows 11 sound not working" the first result I get is https://www.makeuseof.com/fix-no-audio-windows-11/ which is much more user friendly.

The system itself is one part of the problem, and that's the part that has been improving for years. The community providing technical help is another; Linux help forums are often full of technical users advising technical users whereas Windows help threads are usually novice users asking help and getting it in simple terms.

Re: Microsoft’s new Windows prompts try to stop people downloading Chrome

#373

Post by tester756 »

1_player wrote: post #345
tester756 wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Non-tech people still trust Google much more than Microsoft. Microsoft is bad, but they haven't made your data their core business just yet. That's pretty interesting claim, what makes you think so?

There is nothing interesting or crazy about my statement. Microsoft sells software and services and has done so for the past 35 years. They started getting interested in people data recently but it is not their CORE business. How is this controversial?

I never heard non-tech people talking about whether they trust MS or Google more, like seriously :D

Re: Microsoft’s new Windows prompts try to stop people downloading Chrome

#374

Post by jeegsy »

Angostura wrote: post #197
jeroenhd wrote: post #190

Back when Edgeium was new and just Chrome but with a lot of Google cruft removed, I actually used Edge instead of Chrome when I was on Windows. It was the same browser with some additional tweaks that I quite liked. Then Microsoft started this aggressive, disruptive push to bring it to iOS Safari's level as the only browser people should use. I don't know any good operating systems for normal people anymore. Windows…

> iOS Safari's level as the only browser people should use. FWIW, iOS doesn't chide you when you download Chrome or Firefox. Of course Apple requires them to use the iOS rendering engine - but that's perhaps a slightly different point.

> Of course Apple requires them to use the iOS rendering engine

How is apple allowed to do this? Would MSoft have escaped the legal trouble back then if they had simply insisted that Netscape had to run like IE?

Re: Microsoft’s new Windows prompts try to stop people downloading Chrome

#375

Post by throw10920 »

fartcannon wrote: post #227
belorn wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Who on Earth would continue using a browser that has such hostile behavior and dark patterns all over the place Every kind of technology today has clear and visible dark patterns. In the past it was advertisement everywhere and now it is user-hostile design. See any discussion about smart tv, subscription services, webshops, smart devices, phones, apps or any other technology topics and the issue of dark patterns w…

There is no darkness in the world of FOSS, it's an actual, currently functioning, computing utopian dream. Let Caeser have his awful stuff. We can all push for fun, and free computing.

> it's an actual, currently functioning, computing utopian dream

False. The FOSS software that I personally use is less useful (on a practical technical level) on average than its technical equivalents.

And beyond my specific tools (which I admit could just be the bad parts of FOSS), FOSS software is near-universally bad (along with almost every other piece of software I've touched - this isn't a condemnation of FOSS, only a pointing out of the fact that it's not good, just better), and nowhere close to a "computing utopian dream". The amount of issues that I've found in open-source software wouldn't fit in a blog post, let alone an HN comment (although if anyone really wants I could provide a sampling).

You can say that some pieces of FOSS are better than their proprietary equivalents in a technical sense, sure - but I've never actually found a single piece of software, FOSS or not, that is anywhere close to "utopian" (or barely even "functioning").

Re: Microsoft’s new Windows prompts try to stop people downloading Chrome

#376

Post by selfhoster11 »

Causality1 wrote: post #263
handrous wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm struggling to think of any improvements since Win7. The only thing that might qualify is WSL, but that's still experimental and buggy (yes, I know some people have had success with it, anyway). IIRC Win7 was the one that started installing most drivers without any user effort, which was really nice. It also bloated minimum disk size to many times that of XP (or a very full-fat Linux install, so the drivers can't…

Amen. I'm pretty sure 7 is the last Windows ill ever feel happy about installing.

I think that it's really sad that I will mostly agree with you.

Re: Microsoft’s new Windows prompts try to stop people downloading Chrome

#377

Post by mise_en_place »

pierrebai wrote: post #316
mise_en_place wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotal but I’ve never had any issue with Linux. Aside from installing Nvidia proprietary drivers when secureboot is enabled. In which case DKMS is broken so I had to enroll a new signing key in MOK and use that to sign the nvidia kernel driver. If I need to run Windows, I will either use WINE or single GPU pass through to a Windows VM on KVM. Never needed to dual boot. Edge on Linux is great actually, I just don’t…

That was a crash course on how to self-disprove one's argument, all in the first sentence. "It works well, except for this extremely common use case that requires arcane knowledge to fix."

Or you could just disable SecureBoot. I needed it for a specific use case on my laptop that had sensitive work related information (full disk encryption plus SecureBoot enabled).

Re: Microsoft’s new Windows prompts try to stop people downloading Chrome

#378

Post by selfhoster11 »

loudtieblahblah wrote: post #88
mynameismon wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is exactly what I love about Windows 11 particularly. I don't have to deal the abdominations like Microsoft News, just a winget away. Don't like Edge? winget uninstall -e "Microsoft.Edge"

i look at advancements like this in Windows and think it's really cool. But after spending so many years, especially in the late 90s and early 2000s, getting shit from a bunch of khaki wearing, corporate butt kissing MSCE types about how Linux is "get what you pay for" and constantly mocking that all this "free software can't do anything" and then sitting back and watching Linux empowering cloud computing, Unix/Linux…

> and i just can't help being figuratively stick up my middle finger.

My personal opinion on WSL and other "Linux integration" tech in a nutshell. We MADE this world. How dare they try to domesticate it! How dare they take our ladders, pulling them up right after they are done building their monopolies!

> At this juncture - i don't even particularly like desktop computing, no matter the flavor. It's all frustrating in their own ways - including my precious Linux.

I don't even want to see a Year of the Linux Desktop any more. It's a dumpster fire. Serenity OS and Haiku deserve their own Year of the "X" Desktop far more than we do. The Linux can keep its Century of the Linux Server trophy instead. And it's not a consolation prize, but a real achievement.

Re: Microsoft’s new Windows prompts try to stop people downloading Chrome

#380

Post by tsol »

thesuperbigfrog wrote: post #40
thesuperbigfrog wrote: post #10

"Microsoft Edge runs on the same technology as Chrome, with the added trust of Microsoft." They named their user tracking, telemetry, and "Buy Now, Pay Later" add-ons "trust"? That's really Orwellian.

"WAR IS PEACE" "FREEDOM IS SLAVERY" "IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH" "TRACKING IS SAFETY" "CHOICE IS DEFAULT"

Literally 1984 /s

But really I feel like people jump to the antiauthoritarian rhetoric really quickly nowadays. I know your making a joke, but damn if I'm not worried we're kind of normalizing the concept

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