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Is the four-day workweek finally within our grasp?

nytimes.com

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Re: Is the four-day workweek finally within our grasp?

#291

Post by adolph »

vkou wrote: post #247
adolph wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No, what it does is it causes prices to go up, which are amortized across all of society - between both people who are paid $15/hour, and people who are paid $150/hour. Do people who are paid 10x necessarily consume 10x over a person paid minimum wage? If raising the minimum wage causes across the board price increases (aka inflation), then those whose income is lower are affected more since a higher percentage of…

> Do people who are paid 10x necessarily consume 10x over a person paid minimum wage? Even if their consumption was 1x, my point would still stand. Most people aren't earning minimum wage, nor are their salaries affected by minimum wage increases. This means that the cost of most products does not increase as minimum wages increase. Minimum wage increase money comes from somewhere, and since ~everyone relies on minim…

The stealth taxation of inflation affects the lowest 30 in the 100 the most in order to pay the lowest 10. The change in purchase power is not like taxing everyone $1. Whether it’s like taxing on a sliding scale from low to high income that is $1 to $.5 or $1 to $0, I don’t know, just $1 across the board isn’t right. There are probably second order confounders as well, for example since federal gas ax is not inflation indexed, inflation acts as a tax cut.

“It isn’t the sum you get, it's how much you can buy with it, that's the important thing; and it's that that tells whether your wages are high in fact or only high in name.”

Mark Twain A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court (1889)[0]

0. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S221480431...

Re: Is the four-day workweek finally within our grasp?

#292

Post by philmcp »

I'd say its definitely within our grasp. It's a longterm trend which has only been accelerated by COVID

Plus there are now many companies offering this benefit, which is one of the most powerful hiring selling points for companies who cannot compete with FAANG salaries:

https://4dayweek.io/companies

Re: Is the four-day workweek finally within our grasp?

#293

Post by octodog »

frontman1988 wrote: post #190
lolsal wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Life happens outside of two months a year, though.

Yet those two months will be more memorable than the ten months of monotonous life. I just feel work and related city life bullshit stays with you even on the weekends. There is some fun in just escaping. Or maybe I am too much vacation starved due to covid lol.

I don't feel the same way but that's totally fair enough. Do you have any opportunities to take unpaid leave and use some savings for that 1-2 month period?

Re: Is the four-day workweek finally within our grasp?

#294

Post by irrational »

seoulmetro wrote: post #274
irrational wrote: post #212

My company typically gives everyone half days on Fridays from Memorial Day to Labor Day (and most people only put in a token amount of work - if that - on those Fridays - no meetings are allowed to be scheduled on any Friday of the year). This year, in addition to that, they gave everyone every Friday off for the month of July. And... the company still functioned just fine. We run on sprints and we finished just as m…

That just sounds like your company has too many employees. But also if they haven't discovered this themselves, good on them for paying for extra, unneeded jobs.

Well, the company does have tens of thousands of employees. I'm not sure how anyone would determine if there are too many. Of course some of the salaried employees are the lifeguards at the pool, the rock climbing wall people, etc. You would probably consider those to be extra, unneeded jobs.

Re: Is the four-day workweek finally within our grasp?

#295

Post by OldHand2018 »

Animats wrote: post #289
OldHand2018 wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'd never hire a full time employee who can work remotely. I'd employ a contractor who has to itemize their invoice. That's a knee-jerk reaction that you probably already know has some serious problems ;) People who are working 40 hours a week have no capacity to take on some important task with no notice unless they go past 40 hours a week. Which generally doesn't cost any extra money. Hiring a contractor to work…

People who are working 40 hours a week have no capacity to take on some important task with no notice unless they go past 40 hours a week. Which generally doesn't cost any extra money. Which is the problem. What we need is overtime for all. Time and a half after 8 hours in a day. Time and a half after 40 hours in a week. Time and a half after 5 days in a week. Double time on Sunday. Minimum of 4 hours of pay per work…

I don't disagree with you at all. If you regularly exceed 40 hours with exempt employees (especially developers) the compensation structure will have to reflect that or you will have retention problems.

That cost is far more transparent when dealing with hourly contractors, and maybe the employer prefers this! But, you know, theory of the firm etc tells us that in the long run you are usually better off with exempt employees even if they are frequently working less than the 40 hours you expect from them.

Re: Is the four-day workweek finally within our grasp?

#296

Post by ajacksified »

throwaway803453 wrote: post #27

FWH has exposed how many white-collar jobs were only full-time in the ass-in-seat sense and how many employees should have Professional Meeting Attender as their job title. I used to be the guy who would champion efficient meeting practices. Now it's the last thing I want given that I can now work-out, make breakfast, do manual labor, etc., while listening to meeting. 4 day work week in grasp you ask ? For many I'd b…

I'm not surprised you made a throwaway to hide behind, because not only are you a coward, but this is the worst take I've ever seen on a website full of terrible takes. I can't imagine working for someone with this point of view, and I'll happily say that, on the record, without a throwaway account.

As an engineering manager- an actual one- I'm not paying for hours, I'm paying for output. I couldn't care less if my employee was working 15 hours or 40, as long as they got an appropriate amount of work done for my investment in them.

Are we praising someone for demanding itemized timesheets? How absolutely toxic.

Re: Is the four-day workweek finally within our grasp?

#298

Post by lyjackal »

irrational wrote: post #212

My company typically gives everyone half days on Fridays from Memorial Day to Labor Day (and most people only put in a token amount of work - if that - on those Fridays - no meetings are allowed to be scheduled on any Friday of the year). This year, in addition to that, they gave everyone every Friday off for the month of July. And... the company still functioned just fine. We run on sprints and we finished just as m…

Any chance you’re hiring?

Re: Is the four-day workweek finally within our grasp?

#300

Post by elisbce »

People are just lazy, greedy, and never satisfied. After 4-day workweek is a norm, people would think working 4 days a week is a horrible crime against mankind by capitalism, and ask for 3-day workweeks, etc. This will keep going until the country is broke and everyone is f*ked, but who cares if it doesn't happen in the next 10 years?
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