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Microsoft CEO sells half his stock, weeks before WA state implements gains tax

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Re: Microsoft CEO sells half his stock, weeks before WA state implements gains tax

#41

Post by mrgordon »

AlexTWithBeard wrote: post #21
systemvoltage wrote: post #2

I predict that people will leave Washington State in droves. Not because of the tax increase, but because the amount of taxes you pay goes into never ending government pit of inefficiency and incompetency. I’m down with paying more taxes but in return I want no homelessness, no chadzone, less crime, better roads, straight forward education (math is racist apparently), spotless streets, safety, eradication of poverty,…

New York State here. Some of the highest property and income taxes in exchange for - shitty expensive roads - just "meh" state university - the worst subway I saw in any country (and there were a few) and I can keep whinging for another half an hour.

You’re saying NYC has the worst subway? If so, you’re seriously taking it for granted.

It’s the only subway I’m aware of with two sets of tracks so it can run 24 hours even while maintenance is performed usually. It’s better than basically any other subway in America as a start and certainly better than many others as well.

That said, the United States is clearly terrible at public transport overall.

Re: Microsoft CEO sells half his stock, weeks before WA state implements gains tax

#42

Post by nostrademons »

atdrummond wrote: post #37
nostrademons wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would be dividends. Capital gains (in theory at least) are the result of a company investing in its future earning capacity, eg. hiring scientists for R&D, building a new factory, spending money on SaaS upgrades, etc. These all come out of the income statement as expenses, and aren't recorded as profit, so the company doesn't pay corporate taxes on them. You'd potentially have a point for buybacks, which are usu…

Those future earnings from present investments, when finally realized, will be taxed unless the corporate income tax is eliminated.

But someone who sells a security backed by the cash flows from those future investments is receiving cash before the cash flows have materialized (or been taxed). There's also no guarantee that they will ever be taxed. Take, for example, a startup that continually reinvests all profits in additional R&D, sales, and marketing, gets increasing large revenue streams, but then sells the whole company to a bigger one before ever realizing a GAAP profit. Capital gains tax is Uncle Sam's way of taking a cut on all the intermediate owners who benefit from the business reinvestment but know how to turn profits into larger market share.

Re: Microsoft CEO sells half his stock, weeks before WA state implements gains tax

#43

Post by systemvoltage »

mrgordon wrote: post #41
AlexTWithBeard wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

New York State here. Some of the highest property and income taxes in exchange for - shitty expensive roads - just "meh" state university - the worst subway I saw in any country (and there were a few) and I can keep whinging for another half an hour.

You’re saying NYC has the worst subway? If so, you’re seriously taking it for granted. It’s the only subway I’m aware of with two sets of tracks so it can run 24 hours even while maintenance is performed usually. It’s better than basically any other subway in America as a start and certainly better than many others as well. That said, the United States is clearly terrible at public transport overall.

You clearly have not been overseas. NY subways are possibly the filthiest, Ill-running subway system in the world. Frequent delays, crime, the stench, the cost; every single aspect of it is no match for say Tokyo subway or Prague metro.

Improvement starts with self-introspection and realization. American exceptionalism is all I can see.

Re: Microsoft CEO sells half his stock, weeks before WA state implements gains tax

#44

Post by OldHand2018 »

tiernano wrote: post #11
ren_engineer wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I wish there was a better way to inject free market competition into the government it's called immigration, people move to states/nations with the best functioning governments if they are allowed free movement. Historically voting with your feet has been the best way to change government. See Illinois and it's massive budget shortfall due to people leaving the state also look at the Soviet Union which needed border…

> See Illinois and it's massive budget shortfall due to people leaving the state Does this really make them think of changing stuff, or will they just increase taxes and try get more money? I mean, most governments will do the latter before fixing the issue (they don't want to admit the issue is with them...) [NOTE] not a US citizen, so cant don't know much about US politics

Illinois budget problems are due primarily to pension promises made decades ago. The current state government is reasonably well run, for the most part.

If you look at the 2020 Census data, the Chicago metro area grew slightly while the rural areas and small towns lost population. The state saw a growth in high earners that pay lots of taxes, and a loss in lower income folks that pay relatively low taxes.

Since you mention politics: Illinois will send 1 fewer person to the US Congress next year. Currently, there are 13 Democrats and 5 Republicans from Illinois. After the elections next year, there are almost certainly going to be 14 Democrats and 3 Republicans. Knowing that might help understand some of the criticism…

Re: Microsoft CEO sells half his stock, weeks before WA state implements gains tax

#45

Post by valleyer »

kadoban wrote: post #31
pirate787 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Capital gains taxes are double taxation...the company already pays income taxes on its profit.

By that definition, everything is double-taxation. The check I get from my employer comes out of the company profits too.

In many jurisdictions, including the United States, an employer does not pay income tax on the money they pay out in payroll.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_tax

Re: Microsoft CEO sells half his stock, weeks before WA state implements gains tax

#46

Post by JoeyBananas »

ttymck wrote: post #18
JoeyBananas wrote: post #17

Capital gains tax is a bad idea because it hurts businesses. It takes money out of the economy and puts it into the government where it is spent less efficiently.

I'm sure your argument is deeper, but what you have written could be said about any tax, no? Is there something unique about capital gains tax in particular?

> Is there something unique about capital gains tax in particular?

The reason why we are seeing pushes to adopt capital gains tax right now is because Bernie Sanders, AOC, et. al. want to "Tax the Billionaires." This is obviously a popular slogan because people think "who the hell needs 1 billion dollars?" But it's not like billionaires literally have 1 billion dollars just sitting in their bank accounts not doing anything. In reality, billionaires are billionaires because they make their money work for them through various investments. Capital gains tax is not "taking some poor billionaire's leftover yacht money," it's a tax on _the businesses they own_. Although capital gains tax disincentives the growth of business (which is a bad thing because we want businesses to grow,) it's marketed as a "tax on fat-cat bastard billionaires."

Re: Microsoft CEO sells half his stock, weeks before WA state implements gains tax

#47

Post by prirun »

mikestew wrote: post #14
systemvoltage wrote: post #2

I predict that people will leave Washington State in droves. Not because of the tax increase, but because the amount of taxes you pay goes into never ending government pit of inefficiency and incompetency. I’m down with paying more taxes but in return I want no homelessness, no chadzone, less crime, better roads, straight forward education (math is racist apparently), spotless streets, safety, eradication of poverty,…

Not because of the tax increase, but because the amount of taxes you pay goes into never ending government pit of inefficiency and incompetency. From my POV, having lived here for 20 years, WA residents used to get a reasonable deal on their taxes. Sure, they were high from the perspective of this Midwestern boy, but the ferries ran on time and shit got done. I do not feel that's the case anymore (well, the ferries a…

Michigan solved their shitty road problem: they created a state insurance fund that you could file claims against if a pot hole tore up your car. Some of their pot holes were (and I assume still are) more like craters.

I moved back home to Indiana in 2005 and don't miss the shitty weather or roads.

Re: Microsoft CEO sells half his stock, weeks before WA state implements gains tax

#48

Post by quickthrowman »

JoeyBananas wrote: post #17

Capital gains tax is a bad idea because it hurts businesses. It takes money out of the economy and puts it into the government where it is spent less efficiently.

> It takes money out of the economy and puts it into the government where it is spent less efficiently.

Who do you think the government buys goods and services from?

Re: Microsoft CEO sells half his stock, weeks before WA state implements gains tax

#49

Post by mbg721 »

ttymck wrote: post #18
JoeyBananas wrote: post #17

Capital gains tax is a bad idea because it hurts businesses. It takes money out of the economy and puts it into the government where it is spent less efficiently.

I'm sure your argument is deeper, but what you have written could be said about any tax, no? Is there something unique about capital gains tax in particular?

Yes, it sounds like it only affects the wealthy, so it's low-hanging fruit.

Re: Microsoft CEO sells half his stock, weeks before WA state implements gains tax

#50

Post by ryandrake »

valleyer wrote: post #45
kadoban wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By that definition, everything is double-taxation. The check I get from my employer comes out of the company profits too.

In many jurisdictions, including the United States, an employer does not pay income tax on the money they pay out in payroll. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_tax

But that money will be taxed when it's used to pay your electrician. Then, that money will be taxed again when your electrician uses it to buy something from a shop keeper. And then, that money will be taxed again when that shop keeper pays his employee. Then that money will be taxed again when the employee gets his dry cleaning done. There's no law or sensible principle that a dollar should be taxed exactly once in its entire existence.
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