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The origins of ‘horn ok please,’ India’s most ubiquitous phrase (2016)

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Re: The origins of ‘horn ok please,’ India’s most ubiquitous phrase (2016)

#321

Post by dilipdasilva »

Etheryte wrote: post #32
iso1631 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Indian drivers rarely use their side mirrors" Doesn't matter if the mirrors are there or not if culturally people don't use them.

I experienced confusion about this when I travelled to Indonesia some years ago, but a local taxi driver made it easy to understand: "What's in front of you is your responsibility." It's an unwritten local driving rule and once you know it, the local traffic is considerably easier to grok. No one looks behind them because everyone's agreed that they only worry about things in front of them. If you want to pass a car…

This is how skiing works. You worry about what is in front of you. People behind you have to worry about themselves.

Re: The origins of ‘horn ok please,’ India’s most ubiquitous phrase (2016)

#322

Post by ganeshkrishnan »

sdfjkl wrote: post #85

Different cultures have different unwritten behaviours on roads. In the mountains of Italy, drivers give a short honk before entering a turn on a serpentine road, which usually can't be seen around. If there is no responding honk, they will take the full width of the road (making the very tight turn easier and faster). Tourist drivers have to pick up on this :) In much of Europe oncoming cars flash their lights to wa…

>And amongst truck drivers it's pretty wide-spread to blink right to tell a following car you think it's safe for them to overtake you and blink left when you think it no longer is

In India, the truck drivers blink right to tell you its safe (or want you) to overtake from right and they blink left if it's safe (or they want you) to overtake from the left.

Makes highway driving very confusing since a blinking left truck on highway means the exact opposite of city driving (YOU can go left vs I am going left).

yeah, self driving car is not coming anytime soon to India.

Re: The origins of ‘horn ok please,’ India’s most ubiquitous phrase (2016)

#323

Post by Etheryte »

flerchin wrote: post #140
Etheryte wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More or less is relative. In 2019, Indonesia had 15.3 road deaths per 100.000 inhabitants per year [0]. For context, Norway had 2.0, United States had 12.4, and Liberia (the worst on the list) had 35.9, to pick a few random data points. While I definitely agree that the traffic in Indonesia is chaotic and that can lead to more accidents, that doesn't tell the whole story. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cou…

To me, the Fatalities per mile is the most meaningful metric, but that's very sparsely populated on the chart. The next most meaningful metric on that chart is Fatalities per 100k vehicles. Somali car owners have a 6.5% chance of dying in their vehicles, annually.

I'm not sure if I see how fatalities per 100k vehicles is a better metric than per 100k inhabitants: the composition of vehicles is very different from country to country. Given the example above, in Indonesia I would expect a very considerable portion to be scooters which while more dangerous for the driver themselves are safer for others. Meanwhile in the United States, cars are the big majority, being safer for the driver but more dangerous to others.

Re: The origins of ‘horn ok please,’ India’s most ubiquitous phrase (2016)

#324

Post by davchana »

Also, there is a vehicle company Tata, making many vehicles including trucks. Then same word is also used when we waive goodbye with hands, like Tata. Parents usually usee to say to their own kids when leaving friend's house, Ok Do Tata (means waive your arms in goodbye and say tata). Trucks also write OK TATA BYE on back of them.

Re: The origins of ‘horn ok please,’ India’s most ubiquitous phrase (2016)

#325

Post by Arnavion »

mindcrime wrote: post #209
JulianMorrison wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IIRC English - Indian English, not British or American - is the second language of the most people in India. Otherwise, they have so many local languages they would be mutually incomprehensible. But everyone learns English, and so they can talk and do business.

I had two Indian co-workers once, and we got into talking about languages. I was a bit surprised at the time to find out that the only language they shared in common was English. One spoke English, Tamil, and a regional dialect, and the other spoke English, Hindi, and a (different) regional dialect. I later came to find that this is actually quite common in India. And I understand English is still widely taught there…

>And I understand English is still widely taught there, as a legacy of British colonialism, and so many (most?) Indian people - especially in urban areas - do speak English to some extent.

"English is still widely taught here" is an understatement. Upper- and middle-upper-class children usually go to "English medium" schools, where all classes are taught in English (except for the local language class, eg the Hindi class is taught in Hindi), and you're expected to speak only English when talking to other kids and teachers as long as you're on school grounds.

And yes, the only common language you can expect to find when talking to someone who could be from any other part of India is English. If you were talking to shopkeepers, laborers, etc, you'd likely need to use the local language, though they'll have a bare understanding of English words for things like the items they sell.

Even when speaking to people who do understand the local language, most people will speak in a blend of English and the local language, eg Hinglish (English + Hindi) where many nouns will be from English and connecting words will be from Hindi. People who speak in pure Hindi tend to be of the "old-fashioned" stereotype - Sanskrit / Hindi teachers or religious teachers / saints or nationalist extremists.

Re: The origins of ‘horn ok please,’ India’s most ubiquitous phrase (2016)

#326

Post by kube-system »

dvirsky wrote: post #317
kube-system wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or even poorly aligned OEM lights. Most US states don't have vehicle inspections, and the ones that do usually aren't checking headlight alignment.

You have to have your headlights alignment tested every year in Israel. And being caught with badly aligned lights can lead to a ticket if a police car is on the receiving end.

A number of US states have inspections that cover proper operation of lights, but often in practice it isn't anything more than checking to make sure they aren't burnt out. Having improperly aimed headlights is also ticketable in the US but it isn't often enforced.

Re: The origins of ‘horn ok please,’ India’s most ubiquitous phrase (2016)

#327

Post by slingnow »

rahoulb wrote: post #157
technothrasher wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> For me, the horn is a warning sign Here in Massachusetts, it seems the horn has only three functions. The first, a quick "beep beep" signals that you recognize another driver or pedestrian and are saying hello. The second, a one to three second beep means that the traffic light has switched to green and car in front of you has not begun moving within 20ms. And the third, a five to sixty second "beeeeeeeeep" means t…

We have a fourth one - you're a woman or a non-white person and I'm going to lean out of the window and yell obscenities at you.

No, we don't.

Re: The origins of ‘horn ok please,’ India’s most ubiquitous phrase (2016)

#328

Post by mindcrime »

Arnavion wrote: post #325
mindcrime wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had two Indian co-workers once, and we got into talking about languages. I was a bit surprised at the time to find out that the only language they shared in common was English. One spoke English, Tamil, and a regional dialect, and the other spoke English, Hindi, and a (different) regional dialect. I later came to find that this is actually quite common in India. And I understand English is still widely taught there…

>And I understand English is still widely taught there, as a legacy of British colonialism, and so many (most?) Indian people - especially in urban areas - do speak English to some extent. "English is still widely taught here" is an understatement. Upper- and middle-upper-class children usually go to "English medium" schools, where all classes are taught in English (except for the local language class, eg the Hindi c…

"English is still widely taught here" is an understatement. Upper- and middle-upper-class children usually go to "English medium" schools, where all classes are taught in English (except for the local language class, eg the Hindi class is taught in Hindi), and you're expected to speak only English when talking to other kids and teachers as long as you're on school grounds.

Wow. I didn't realize that English was that deeply embedded into Indian society. Fascinating how these things play out over time.

Re: The origins of ‘horn ok please,’ India’s most ubiquitous phrase (2016)

#329

Post by oblio »

alex_smart wrote: post #311
oblio wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's probably going to change as they get more cars, more highways and better driver educations. It's probably going to take decades.

No change is automatic. Why will it change just because there are more cars and more highways? And where is the push for better driver education? There is none.

It comes naturally as you start wanting to move faster and get better cars.

You can't go 130kmph honking your way through mopeds and rickshaws.

Re: The origins of ‘horn ok please,’ India’s most ubiquitous phrase (2016)

#330

Post by jagger27 »

clort wrote: post #288
hadlock wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This technology exists in Europe, it's not allowed in the US due to very specific wording about headlight laws here, but very recently regulations were changed to allow for it. Not sure if it was in the infrastructure bill that already passed, or the follow-up one they're currently trying to pass. Most BMW (and probably Mercedes, Audi etc) with adaptive LED lights built after ~2017 have the hardware for this for use…

This technology is not great on a windy[1] european road though. I rented a car recently and noticed that it was auto-dipping but the problem is it dips once it has detected the oncoming vehicle. That is fractionally too late as the driver has already been dazzled. Manually, I would dip the headlights just before the car came into view because I could see the headlights looming. [1] a road with lots of turns, not one…

“Winding road” is a nice way to disambiguate from gusty.
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