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Why don’t we just open the windows? Covid-19 prevention lost in translation

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Re: Why don’t we just open the windows? Covid-19 prevention lost in translation

#71

Post by coolso »

selimthegrim wrote: post #55
adventured wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's trivial to get volunteers. I'll volunteer. In the US we're around SARS2 spreaders all the time. Every time you spend ~30 minutes walking around in a major retail store chain you're highly likely to be exposed to SARS2. Now do that N times per week like most Americans have been for the past year plus. What am I supposed to be afraid of compared to that? I've had Covid; early into the pandemic. It was quite unplea…

Imagine all those anti vaxxers' complaints about "It's being rushed out too quickly" and "It hasn't been studied yet" magnified with your proposed express schedule. Do you think there wouldn't have been vaccine hesitancy in those 100k?

> Imagine all those anti vaxxers' complaints about "It's being rushed out too quickly" and "It hasn't been studied yet"

Listen, CNN [0] and Biden [1] changed their mind about all of that as soon as the election was over, so don’t be too hard on them.

[0] https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/01/health/eua-coronavirus-vaccin...

[1] https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/16/us/politics/biden-trump-c...

Re: Why don’t we just open the windows? Covid-19 prevention lost in translation

#72

Post by willyt »

> Pumping in adequate amounts of fresh outside air, however engineered, will challenge running costs as well as carbon status.

This is wrong. Mechanical Heat Recovery Ventilation (MVHR) is a well established technology which can recycle 96% of the heat from the waste air in a house. It costs about the same to fit as a central heating system. Passive houses have very high Air Changes per Hour (ACH) compared to conventional houses, at 0.4 ACH all the air in the house is replaced approximately every 2.5 hours. All while having a whole house heat load measuring in the hundreds of watts to maintain 21ºC inside when it’s -1ºC outside. There is no reason not to put MVHR in normal houses, it’s just not possible to supply all the heat demand using air supply alone so you need a conventional heating system as well.

EDIT: Also this just goes to show what happens when people make uninformed comments on fields they don’t understand, this sentence could make a whole lot of work on reducing energy consumption in buildings get thrown out the window. I would have expected better from people that have just had 1.5 years first hand experience of the effects of misinformation on their own field.

Re: Why don’t we just open the windows? Covid-19 prevention lost in translation

#73

Post by geolqued »

nitrogen wrote: post #63
exclipy wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Australia earlier this year when infections were happening the rate of single-digits per day, they could trace the source of an infection to a fleeting encounter of two people walking past each other in a shop. Source: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-06-22/covid19-cctv-footage-...

I haven't followed Australia's progress with COVID-19, so I hope these questions aren't too obvious or bothersome: Were these single-digit infections all symptomatic, or were they detecting asymptomatic infections too? What is the false positive and false negative rate of the type of testing Australia is doing, and how many people were being tested during this time? If some of the infections were asymptomatic, is it…

Positives would be re-tested to rule out false positives.

In that period 30k-60k people where being tested in NSW. https://www.covid19data.com.au/nsw

Re: Why don’t we just open the windows? Covid-19 prevention lost in translation

#74

Post by sjg007 »

jaspax wrote: post #7
KevinEldon wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re volunteering?

I would volunteer. It turns out that I have COVID right now , giving me a mild headache, nasal congestion, and a persistent cough---annoying, but not more than that. I would have gladly volunteered for this level of mild discomfort in order to advance the cause of science. Wouldn't even be hard.

Please keep a close eye on your blood o2 saturation and stay in contact with your doctor.

Re: Why don’t we just open the windows? Covid-19 prevention lost in translation

#75

Post by robbiep »

nitrogen wrote: post #63
exclipy wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Australia earlier this year when infections were happening the rate of single-digits per day, they could trace the source of an infection to a fleeting encounter of two people walking past each other in a shop. Source: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-06-22/covid19-cctv-footage-...

I haven't followed Australia's progress with COVID-19, so I hope these questions aren't too obvious or bothersome: Were these single-digit infections all symptomatic, or were they detecting asymptomatic infections too? What is the false positive and false negative rate of the type of testing Australia is doing, and how many people were being tested during this time? If some of the infections were asymptomatic, is it…

I have not seen widespread data on symptomatic vs unsymptomatic cases however during the most recent NSW surge around 5-7% of new infections ended up presenting to hospital at some stage. Testing was widespread and likely highly compliant - daily testing stats were available, NSW at one point was having 180k tests per day (PCR). People were notified of sites of exposure (or via checkin apps) and asked to test. Given it was PCR, false positives were as you would expect quite low but there were at least 2-3 false positives I recall being discussed in the media.

In answer to your final question - no - they were PCR confirmed cases. There was also a high degree of sequencing occurring to enable clarity on lineage transmission

Re: Why don’t we just open the windows? Covid-19 prevention lost in translation

#76

Post by ajmurmann »

orblivion wrote: post #11

It baffles me that Fauci etc didn't mention this in the next breath after hand washing and masking. It's easy during nice weather.

Is hand washing even that relevant given the virus gets mostly inhaled? I've never seen any studies on this.

Re: Why don’t we just open the windows? Covid-19 prevention lost in translation

#77

Post by mbo »

jaimex2 wrote: post #44

Explains Queensland doing so well here in Australia thinking about it. Everything is built with high ventilation flow in mind.

I thought exactly the same thing!

For those unaware, Queensland (population 5.185 million) _still_ has yet to have a large scale outbreak since March 2020.

It's common to have windows permanently open with fly screens here. And houses in the typical Queenslander architectural style[0] are up on stilts and deliberately laid out to encourage a breeze pulling air from front to back. Rooms are often not sealed, with fanlights above door-frames allowing in airflow. This design philosophy extends to commercial buildings as well.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queenslander_(architecture)

Re: Why don’t we just open the windows? Covid-19 prevention lost in translation

#78

Post by ajmurmann »

shmel wrote: post #53
KevinEldon wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re volunteering?

Come on, there are tons of people who believe that masks are the final answer. They should volunteer.

Is there anyone who believes masks are "the final answer"? I'm very much in favor of mask wearing and would love to see some real enforcement of mask mandates, but while masks are important they are just an important factor that can help safe some lives. I've never talked to anyone who thought masks on their own are the answer.

Re: Why don’t we just open the windows? Covid-19 prevention lost in translation

#79

Post by encryptluks2 »

coolso wrote: post #71
selimthegrim wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine all those anti vaxxers' complaints about "It's being rushed out too quickly" and "It hasn't been studied yet" magnified with your proposed express schedule. Do you think there wouldn't have been vaccine hesitancy in those 100k?

> Imagine all those anti vaxxers' complaints about "It's being rushed out too quickly" and "It hasn't been studied yet" Listen, CNN [0] and Biden [1] changed their mind about all of that as soon as the election was over, so don’t be too hard on them. [0] https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/01/health/eua-coronavirus-vaccin... [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/16/us/politics/biden-trump-c...

I won't get the Trump vaccine, I'll get the Biden vaccine instead! Ree!

Re: Why don’t we just open the windows? Covid-19 prevention lost in translation

#80

Post by WalterBright »

anonporridge wrote: post #10
nicoburns wrote: post #4

This agrees with my intuitive impression of everything I've read on Covid-19: that the primary transmission vector is through the being in unventilated or poorly ventilated enclosed spaces with an infected person for ~15 minutes or longer. I definitely feel like neither governmental policies or people's individual precautions and behaviours quite reflect that reality.

A potentially fantastic outcome from all this is that many more public and private spaces will be designed and retrofitted with very good ventilation. Beyond curbing the spread of natural airborne diseases, it also may decrease the attack vector in our societies for airborne bio-terrorism/warfare. And even beyond all that, we're becoming increasingly aware of how important clean air is for our overall health even wit…

A couple years ago I bought a CO2 meter, and was astonished to see it going over 1000ppm in my office. Since then, I always keep the window cracked, keeping the CO2 levels usually under 500.

The meter was one of the best investments I ever made.

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