Live data from Hacker News

Apple stopped sales in Turkey after the lira crashed 15% in a day

reuters.com

121–130 of 251 posts

Re: Apple stopped sales in Turkey after the lira crashed 15% in a day

#121
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Um. Please go do a little research about Venezuela's situation before proposing a simple, wrong solution. They have badly mismanaged their financial and political situation for a long time and are not equipped to make the necessary changes to remedy this (whether the answer be "print more money"). If you'd like to know more about their situation, I recommend reading "The Prize" and "The Quest". Much of the root of th…

Wouldn't stealing all the foreign assets of Venezuela by US and UK also affect the Venezuela economy?

> Wouldn't stealing all the foreign assets of Venezuela by US and UK also affect the Venezuela economy?

There are a number of things wrong with this statement.

1. Timing is off. The U.S. didn't freeze Venezuelan assets until 2019 after Chavez died and the economy had already collapsed.

2. $342 Million in cash was frozen and 1.1. million barrels of oil were seized, the rationale being that this was a small dent to offset the amount of Western assets that Venezuela nationalized without compensation.

3. For years before the US responded, Venezuela nationalized foreign investment in its oil industry, gold mining, agriculture, telecomm, banking, auto manufacturing, paper products, Satellite communication, pharmaceuticals, and many other industries - most seized without compensation. Prior to the 2019 action, the US basically left foreign investors without recourse, as they had to file lawsuits in courts in order to try to obtain compensation.

The value of the foreign assets seized by Venezuela far exceeds the value of Venezuelan foreign holdings seized in response.

The real problem for Venezuela is the flight of human capital by those with skills. Venezuela lacks the skilled workers to operate the industries it has nationalized, which is part of the reason for the economic collapse - the other part being simply the usual effect of socialism on reducing productivity due to the breakdown of the price-system.

Re: Apple stopped sales in Turkey after the lira crashed 15% in a day

#122
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How long did it take them? Could you have gone in bought a ton of stock at old prices and gotten at least some of your 15% back? Apple stuff resells pretty well

If you knew in advance that it was going to crash, there's better ways to profit more directly. If you didn't, seems unlikely you'd be ready to capitalize. Besides, not sure how it works in Turkey, but most places at least: retailers can cancel orders for little to no reason, if you bought a bunch of crap right before such an event, I bet they'd cancel it.

Apple apparently canceled some orders, the social media was full of people complaining about it however the laws don't allow you to cancel orders just like that(when you order something the company and the customers are obligated to sign purchasing agreements that provides ether party with rights and obligations) and many people were quite motivated to sue Apple. Some contacted Apple and the official response was that the cancellations are due to unrelated reasons.

Turkish consumer protection laws are not bad, there are arbitration tribunals and consumer courts that quickly and cheaply resolve that kind of disputes. People use these all the time.

My brother snapped an iPad Air for the equivalent of 450$ and is expecting the delivery anytime now.

Re: Apple stopped sales in Turkey after the lira crashed 15% in a day

#123
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't stealing all the foreign assets of Venezuela by US and UK also affect the Venezuela economy?

Freezing, not stealing, because the chances those assets would be used for the actual benefit of Venezuelans is pretty much zero. They will be returned when Venezuela has a legitimate government.

This is propaganda. The US sanctioned Venezuela to because they do not want anyone in their sphere of influence nationalizing important export industries like oil.

Re: Apple stopped sales in Turkey after the lira crashed 15% in a day

#124
post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't stealing all the foreign assets of Venezuela by US and UK also affect the Venezuela economy?

> Wouldn't stealing all the foreign assets of Venezuela by US and UK also affect the Venezuela economy? There are a number of things wrong with this statement. 1. Timing is off. The U.S. didn't freeze Venezuelan assets until 2019 after Chavez died and the economy had already collapsed. 2. $342 Million in cash was frozen and 1.1. million barrels of oil were seized, the rationale being that this was a small dent to off…

> The value of the foreign assets seized by Venezuela far exceeds the value of Venezuelan foreign holdings seized in response.

This sounds wrong. Do you have a source?

Re: Apple stopped sales in Turkey after the lira crashed 15% in a day

#125
post #27

Question is - if/when the lira rises 15% (#1), will Apple respond as timely to adjust prices cheaper? Mindful that companies are quick to point to a reason to increase prices yet when that same reason goes the other way, not so quick (if ever) to adjust down. Is Black Friday sales a thing in Turkey? As can imagine many who would of banked to buy then, only to get hit with the polar opposite in this instance. #1 - (ma…

Companies can’t be competitive, nor reach sales goals when prices are artificially high. Similarly they also lose sales to neighbouring countries - making price consistency important.

Despite it not fitting the evil megacorp narrative, good business requires prices to follow the currency changes - but not super tightly as that’s also harmful to business and consumers alike. Each company establishes their product margin and excess to that is not desirable - lost sales are invariably more costly than a small % gain in margin.

The other issue is that currencies usually drop quickly but recover slowly, it takes time to undo the instability in the currency and then attract investment to strengthen the currency. In the case of Turkey it’s due to their recent decisions to lower interest rates despite soaring inflation (the opposite of good fiscal policy). This will absolutely prevent any kind of bounce happening and psychological barriers to the currency have already been passed - meaning the currency (and with that the population) is likely to suffer further.

Re: Apple stopped sales in Turkey after the lira crashed 15% in a day

#126
post #40
post #6

The Turkish lira has been plunging vs. the US dollar for 14 years straight. It has fallen by 90% in dollar terms. All foreign retailers must be constantly readjusting prices, right?

Actually, it was fairly stable between 2003-2013. Then the hardcore political stuff began happening, Erdogan won the political fight to become a popular autocrat assuming all power in 2017 by changing the constitution through a referandum then winning the elections - all fairly. When he got free from any checks and balances he was free to implement his unorthodox ideas on economics. He put his son in law in charge of…

This is when in my minds eye flashed some sort of trailer for an as-of-yet un-produced Turkish adaption of The Wolf of Wall Street, hilarious hijinks on a never before seen scale centered around Erdogan as the surprisingly likable protagonist.

Re: Apple stopped sales in Turkey after the lira crashed 15% in a day

#127
post #3

Why don't they just sell in Euro/USD? That's what people did a few decades ago a bit further north, when the local currency wasn't trusted (even if it was rather stable). But yeah, inflation in Eastern Europe is pretty bad, and if you voted for a bunch of dumb assholes who don't care about you or the nation, you're multifucked.

Same reason you cannot pay in euros in US. Lira is a legal tender. Company can peg prices internally to a spot rate to whatever, but if exchange turns to fast volatility, what else can you do?

There is no law preventing one to sell in Euro in US and there is no law mandating a seller to accept USD as payment. "Legal tender" does not mean what most people think.

Re: Apple stopped sales in Turkey after the lira crashed 15% in a day

#129
post #58
post #3

Why don't they just sell in Euro/USD? That's what people did a few decades ago a bit further north, when the local currency wasn't trusted (even if it was rather stable). But yeah, inflation in Eastern Europe is pretty bad, and if you voted for a bunch of dumb assholes who don't care about you or the nation, you're multifucked.

I worked for an e-commerce site that sold cars in Turkey in Euros. Sometime in 2018 I think it was, Erdogan made a new law that said everything had to be traded in Lira.

There are ways to go around. Last year I bought a car (not in Turkey, but very close) and the price was in EURO converted to local currency at the rate of the last payment. I ordered with a downpayment and I got it 3 months later (supply chain slowness) and I paid in local currency the converted price of that day. The car was not sold in EURO, but the price was linked to it.

Re: Apple stopped sales in Turkey after the lira crashed 15% in a day

#130

Maybe they should sell it in Bitcoin and automatically trade for dollars

Hm, Bitcoin appears down 23% in the last 18 days, flailing wildly the whole time. If your concern was stability you would obviously not pick Bitcoin haha. Maybe a nice USD or EUR price tag.

> Maybe they should sell it in Bitcoin and *automatically trade for dollars*

Looks like you didn't read the parent comment.

Post reply on HN