The Handwavy Technobabble Nothingburger of Crypto • Hacker News Board

Re: The Handwavy Technobabble Nothingburger of Crypto

#371

Post by keyme » Wed, Nov 24, 2021, 6:15 PM UTC

What an obnoxious piece of drivel.

"Any application that could be done on a blockchain could be better done on a centralized database. Except crime."

The HN California tech-bros could be forgiven for not "getting it" 2 years ago. However, when leaving your own damn house became a crime, this lack of understanding is beginning to become infuriating.

The value proposition of cryptocurrencies is not only in shielding you from the whims of bureaucrats that are in charge of monetary policies, but of idiotic changes to all policies.

When my country was in a full insane-mode covid lockdown, no centralized database helped me to get a haircut. That haircut guy took only cash or crypto.

When the next insane demand is inevitably decreed upon you, maybe cash won't do anymore either.

Re: The Handwavy Technobabble Nothingburger of Crypto

#372

Post by joshmarlow » Wed, Nov 24, 2021, 6:16 PM UTC

tsimionescu wrote: post #352

joshmarlow wrote: post #157

I think a lot of discussions around the utility of blockchains misses (or just ignores) a really subtle but important point: smart contract networks (like Ethereum) could be thought of like public utilities that are implemented via markets. And I think that perspective can unlock a lot of innovation. If I want to launch a startup, I have to cover hosting costs, manage infrastructure (terraform, AWS/DigitalOcean, Dock…

> But if I can build my app using smart contracts, then they are always available to execute when needed - just pay to write/execute Do you mean that you would build your app so that it entirely runs on the Ethereum network, basically using Ethereum like a cloud provider? This sounds like just a more expensive, difficult, and resource intensive way of running a lambda function...

> This sounds like just a more expensive, difficult, and resource intensive way of running a lambda function...

It definitely would be for some applications - but probably not all. It's all about engineering trade-offs.

There's a possibility that tools with different trade-offs will make new niches feasible.

Re: The Handwavy Technobabble Nothingburger of Crypto

#373

Post by azth » Wed, Nov 24, 2021, 6:16 PM UTC

Scarblac wrote: post #38

I wonder how much of the Crypto hype is because the US banking system still lives in the 1980s or thereabouts. If everybody in the US had access to bank accounts with easy electronic transfers within 5 seconds for no charge, no chargebacks and so on, as people are used to in the EU, would people still be excited about Bitcoin?

Quite a bit of it also comes from the fact that people are tired from the fed printing money at will, devaluing people's hard work they put in for years to save some money.

Secondly, people in the EU are also excited about bitcoin regardless of the fact that they have what you mentioned.

Re: The Handwavy Technobabble Nothingburger of Crypto

#374

Post by koonsolo » Wed, Nov 24, 2021, 6:16 PM UTC

Scarblac wrote: post #38

I wonder how much of the Crypto hype is because the US banking system still lives in the 1980s or thereabouts. If everybody in the US had access to bank accounts with easy electronic transfers within 5 seconds for no charge, no chargebacks and so on, as people are used to in the EU, would people still be excited about Bitcoin?

If PayPal would have realized the vision of Elon Musk, there would be no banks anymore. In that scenario, it would be really hard for crypto to emerge.

But right now, that market is fully open.

Re: The Handwavy Technobabble Nothingburger of Crypto

#375

Post by cwkoss » Wed, Nov 24, 2021, 6:17 PM UTC

This is the second time this week I've seen an article from Diehl on the front page that is critical of cryptocurrency but has next to zero substance. Weird that people regard him as a crypto expert, he doesn't seem to understand the space very well.

- Comparing Bitcoin to doge and shiba is laughable

- Re progcoins, he says "After twelve years of these technologies existing" - Ethereum is only 6 years old...

- Like most other crypto skeptics, this author doesn't understand the value of decentralized value transfer, so his analysis entirely misses the pro's of these technologies. It's like someone trying to understand why candy is popular by only looking at the nutritional information - never tasting it.

I'd bet 1000 SHIBA that one of Diehl's friends tried to convince him to buy in years ago, and now the cognitive dissonance of that rejection costing him hundreds of thousands of dollars in potential gains is forcing him to double down: his ego cannot tolerate crypto success - or else he'd have to admit to himself he was naive and short sided by discounting it years ago.

The majority of coins will eventually fail, and it's even possible all the currently popular ones will be included in that. The road to maturity has been and will continue to be bumpy. But the writing is on the wall that crypto is going to be a major force in global finance for decades to come. Pandora's box is open, anyone who thinks it will entirely flame out and disappear doesn't understand what has happened over the past decade.

Re: The Handwavy Technobabble Nothingburger of Crypto

#376

Post by AlexandrB » Wed, Nov 24, 2021, 6:17 PM UTC

rawtxapp wrote: post #336

llimos wrote: post #301

Most people on HN are rational people who look at the world in a rational way. Bitcoin and friends are not operating in a rational market, therefore we don't understand them, and most of us would probably be pretty lousy investors since we would try to make decisions rationally instead of memeing and YOLOing. But, and this is a key point, that doesn't make us right and them wrong . It's just a different kind of marke…

Are you implying that no rational person should ever buy Bitcoin? That seems a bit far-fetched, no? At this point, considering that it's stronger than ever and it's pretty clear it's not going away, I would expect a rational person to allocate even a small percentage to it for diversification, in case they happen to be wrong on their conclusions or understanding of Bitcoin.

Couldn't you make the same argument for pets.com stock in early 2000? "Diversification" is a conveniently vague reason to invest in something when there are no "fundamentals" that can be evaluated. At the very least pets.com had some assets that could be sold off after the company went under. Bitcoin can't even claim to have that.

Re: The Handwavy Technobabble Nothingburger of Crypto

#377

Post by ycombobreaker » Wed, Nov 24, 2021, 6:19 PM UTC

sjtindell wrote: post #354

llimos wrote: post #301

Most people on HN are rational people who look at the world in a rational way. Bitcoin and friends are not operating in a rational market, therefore we don't understand them, and most of us would probably be pretty lousy investors since we would try to make decisions rationally instead of memeing and YOLOing. But, and this is a key point, that doesn't make us right and them wrong . It's just a different kind of marke…

HN’s attitude is very surprising to me. I would think that they could get very excited about flash loans, decentralized exchanges (automated market makers), daos, and other concrete innovations coming out of crypto asset projects. I think it’s mostly jealousy and a feeling that they missed the boat, so they want to see it sink. I think that because I’ve had the feeling many times. They may not realize these are early…

> automated market makers

Are you claiming that this is an innovation associated with crypto? Can you elaborate or clarify, as the case may be?

Re: The Handwavy Technobabble Nothingburger of Crypto

#378

Post by spfzero » Wed, Nov 24, 2021, 6:19 PM UTC

JuliusBranson wrote: post #357

dragonwriter wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> When there's stablecoin, you just put your dollar in stablecoin before they print the money, the dollar inflates, stablecoin goes up proportionately, Printing fiat makes stablecoins denominated in the currency lose real value, not gain in it. (Stablecoins denominated in a different currency would gain nominal value in the printed currency, the same way direct holdings in the alternative currency would.) So, no, to…

>Printing fiat makes stablecoins denominated in the currency lose real value, not gain in it. What's the case for this statement? In general, I don't expect to commodities to change value just because some currency was redistributed.

The case for it is the denominator increasing.

Re: The Handwavy Technobabble Nothingburger of Crypto

#379

Post by medo-bear » Wed, Nov 24, 2021, 6:20 PM UTC

cwkoss wrote: post #375

This is the second time this week I've seen an article from Diehl on the front page that is critical of cryptocurrency but has next to zero substance. Weird that people regard him as a crypto expert, he doesn't seem to understand the space very well. - Comparing Bitcoin to doge and shiba is laughable - Re progcoins, he says "After twelve years of these technologies existing" - Ethereum is only 6 years old... - Like m…

>this author doesn't understand the value of decentralized value transfer, so his analysis entirely misses the pro's of these technologies

came here to say the same thing, with one addition: unregulated decentralized transfer

the author seems to brush this off as only appealing to criminals

Re: The Handwavy Technobabble Nothingburger of Crypto

#380

Post by mamma_luvs_rust » Wed, Nov 24, 2021, 6:20 PM UTC

llimos wrote: post #301

Most people on HN are rational people who look at the world in a rational way. Bitcoin and friends are not operating in a rational market, therefore we don't understand them, and most of us would probably be pretty lousy investors since we would try to make decisions rationally instead of memeing and YOLOing. But, and this is a key point, that doesn't make us right and them wrong . It's just a different kind of marke…

It's easy to complain and dismiss, but bitcoin literally made me rich