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As calls to ban books intensify, digital librarians offer perspective

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Re: As calls to ban books intensify, digital librarians offer perspective

#11

Post by shagie »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #5

Nobody’s calling for banning books. They are calling for not using certain books in curriculum, which is very different and not allowing certain books is necessary for any school system. I wouldn’t want my kid to write “A kid’s version of Algebra” and then have it used in schools. I wouldn’t want a flat-earther to have his Science book in schools. Who wants Trump’s guide to Civics? That’s super different than “bannin…

> Nobody’s calling for banning books. They are calling for not using certain books in curriculum, which is very different and not allowing certain books is necessary for any school system.

From the other day on NPR: https://www.npr.org/2021/11/11/1054798508/when-schools-ban-b...

> Texas Gov. Greg Abbott joined Krause's efforts this week, sending his own letter to the Texas Education Agency asking it and other agencies "to immediately develop statewide standards to prevent the presence of pornography and other obscene content in Texas public schools, including in school libraries."

> While the censorship of some books in schools is nothing new, a growing number of challenges are against books about race. In her reporting on the topic, KERA reporter Miranda Suarez spoke to Deborah Caldwell-Stone who leads the American Library Association's Office for Intellectual Freedom. Caldwell-Stones said, "We went from a situation where the majority of books being challenged and removed in schools and libraries dealt with LGBTQ themes, to a situation where there's a real mix."

The referenced letter is https://gov.texas.gov/news/post/governor-abbott-directs-tea-...

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So yes, this is a book ban and its not just material in the curriculum but also content in the libraries.

Re: As calls to ban books intensify, digital librarians offer perspective

#12

Post by LocalH »

bwb wrote: post #6
gjsman-1000 wrote: post #5

Nobody’s calling for banning books. They are calling for not using certain books in curriculum, which is very different and not allowing certain books is necessary for any school system. I wouldn’t want my kid to write “A kid’s version of Algebra” and then have it used in schools. I wouldn’t want a flat-earther to have his Science book in schools. Who wants Trump’s guide to Civics? That’s super different than “bannin…

I guess it depends a little on who is making the choices. If it is politician driven, might be fair to call it banning. If it is the school system and teachers making a choice about what to use to teach effectively that seems like good policy.

If they're public schools, the funding is governmental (state-based in the US), and thus there could be an argument made that it is still "banning". In private schools, not so much (but then again, pretty sure private schools can already control their curriculum and the books available to students from the library).

Re: As calls to ban books intensify, digital librarians offer perspective

#13

Post by MisterBastahrd »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #5

Nobody’s calling for banning books. They are calling for not using certain books in curriculum, which is very different and not allowing certain books is necessary for any school system. I wouldn’t want my kid to write “A kid’s version of Algebra” and then have it used in schools. I wouldn’t want a flat-earther to have his Science book in schools. Who wants Trump’s guide to Civics? That’s super different than “bannin…

Sorry, no, that's utterly wrong. "Used in curriculum" means that they would be used in the teaching of subjects in class. There are school districts and entire state school systems that are starting to ban books on the topics of sexual orientation and critical race theory from being in the school library at all.

Re: As calls to ban books intensify, digital librarians offer perspective

#14

Post by bequanna »

bwb wrote: post #6
gjsman-1000 wrote: post #5

Nobody’s calling for banning books. They are calling for not using certain books in curriculum, which is very different and not allowing certain books is necessary for any school system. I wouldn’t want my kid to write “A kid’s version of Algebra” and then have it used in schools. I wouldn’t want a flat-earther to have his Science book in schools. Who wants Trump’s guide to Civics? That’s super different than “bannin…

I guess it depends a little on who is making the choices. If it is politician driven, might be fair to call it banning. If it is the school system and teachers making a choice about what to use to teach effectively that seems like good policy.

I think you have that backwards. Parents and the community should have the final say when deciding what is included in a curriculum, not (potentially activist) teachers and school boards.

Re: As calls to ban books intensify, digital librarians offer perspective

#15

Post by quadrifoliate »

bequanna wrote: post #14
bwb wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess it depends a little on who is making the choices. If it is politician driven, might be fair to call it banning. If it is the school system and teachers making a choice about what to use to teach effectively that seems like good policy.

I think you have that backwards. Parents and the community should have the final say when deciding what is included in a curriculum, not (potentially activist) teachers and school boards.

> Parents and the community should have the final say ...not (potentially activist) teachers and school boards.

Aren't school boards usually elected by the community?

Also, generally, a lot of public school teaching is about encouraging a newer generation to think for themselves, and potentially be exposed to ideas that are not constrained by the parents and the community.

Parents who want to micromanage what ideas their kid is exposed to should consider homeschooling.

Re: As calls to ban books intensify, digital librarians offer perspective

#16

Post by mherdeg »

Were any of the recently withdrawn-by-publisher Seuss books, like "And to Think That I Saw It on Mulberry Street", widely removed from school libraries? Or is this a purely "Beloved" phenomenon?

The closest I could find about coverage on this was an article saying that some libraries reclassified the Seuss books as "reference" to prohibit checkouts because they were being stolen (e.g. https://oxfordobserver.org/5172/community/dr-seuss-enterpris...).

Re: As calls to ban books intensify, digital librarians offer perspective

#17

Post by temp8964 »

Stop confusing K-12 public school libraries with public libraries. K-12 public school libraries always have a small selection of books. Vast majority of books are not in K-12 public school libraries. There is no parallel between select books for K-12 public school libraries and banning books from libraries.

If this is about you want to indoctrinate certain ideology into kids using the public school system, at least be honest about it. Stop pretending this is about banning books.

Stop using the K-12 public school libraries or the public school system as the battle ground for spreading radical political ideologies. Our public school system is already bad enough.

Re: As calls to ban books intensify, digital librarians offer perspective

#18

Post by gjsman-1000 »

shagie wrote: post #11
gjsman-1000 wrote: post #5

Nobody’s calling for banning books. They are calling for not using certain books in curriculum, which is very different and not allowing certain books is necessary for any school system. I wouldn’t want my kid to write “A kid’s version of Algebra” and then have it used in schools. I wouldn’t want a flat-earther to have his Science book in schools. Who wants Trump’s guide to Civics? That’s super different than “bannin…

> Nobody’s calling for banning books. They are calling for not using certain books in curriculum, which is very different and not allowing certain books is necessary for any school system. From the other day on NPR: https://www.npr.org/2021/11/11/1054798508/when-schools-ban-b... > Texas Gov. Greg Abbott joined Krause's efforts this week, sending his own letter to the Texas Education Agency asking it and other agencie…

Well then, again, would you want a flat-earther science manual in the school library?

Schools exercising discretion is not 1940s Germany book bans and the two are not comparable.

Re: As calls to ban books intensify, digital librarians offer perspective

#19

Post by LocalH »

bequanna wrote: post #14
bwb wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess it depends a little on who is making the choices. If it is politician driven, might be fair to call it banning. If it is the school system and teachers making a choice about what to use to teach effectively that seems like good policy.

I think you have that backwards. Parents and the community should have the final say when deciding what is included in a curriculum, not (potentially activist) teachers and school boards.

That only works to a point. If a community decided "math is stupid, our schools shouldn't be teaching it", they should quite rightly be overridden. Instead of treating it like a power grab, perhaps the process for determining curriculum should be more open and transparent?

Re: As calls to ban books intensify, digital librarians offer perspective

#20

Post by derbOac »

Anyone know where there's data on challenges over time?

I could only find these two things:

https://www.ala.org/advocacy/sites/ala.org.advocacy/files/co...

https://bookriot.com/statistics-of-censorship/

I have a feeling something more comprehensive and precise is out there but I don't know where to look. The ALA has a "field report" but they charge for it and I'm not even sure if it would have the content I'm looking for.

Most of the data I can find is on the most frequently challenged books, and the reasons for doing so.

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