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The unbearable fussiness of the smart home

staceyoniot.com

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Re: The unbearable fussiness of the smart home

#91

Post by [deleted] »

pydry wrote: post #20
ninkendo wrote: post #9

I did my whole house in Lutron’s smart switches (close to 50 of them), and I think it’s good? It’s been about 2 years now and I really haven’t had any issues. The switches aren’t Wi-Fi connected, because Wi-Fi would be an awful choice for 50 devices that you only communicate with a few times a day. They use their own wireless frequency and communicate in a really simple/reliable way to the bridge, which is wired to m…

This is how most home automation brands ought to work but it seems that in practice very few do. Most of them want to proxy all attempts to turn on a light switch via AWS. Which is madness.

[deleted]

Re: The unbearable fussiness of the smart home

#93

Post by beardedwizard »

dralley wrote: post #89
beardedwizard wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah yes, the trivial to build, ultra simple crystal oscillator real time clock. Every hobbyist can just fab them right up, or just dig around in the garden to find a few.

Or buy them online for $15 https://www.sparkfun.com/products/12708 Following hobbyist-directed instructions that are, also, readily available online https://create.arduino.cc/projecthub/embeddedlab786/real-tim...

So, order electronics from the internet for my non smart, non internet connected devices. Got it.

Re: The unbearable fussiness of the smart home

#94

Post by maccard »

freddie_mercury wrote: post #70
maccard wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I never think about light in my home, I flip the switch if I need it - lights seem like such a chore to my friends who have to issue commands to a speaker and that’s one of the few things this tech is supposed to be good at Pre-covid we used to leave the dog at home during the day (I now WFH so not an issue), but it gets dark at 3:30 here during the winter, meaning the dog is stuck sitting in the dark for 2 hours.…

> Philips Hue has routines for turning on lamps 30 minutes before sunset FWIW, mechanical timers have been able to do this for decades. 20+ years ago I had a mechanical timer that turned on my porch lights at sunset and off at 11pm. You just needed to configure your latitude so it knew when sunset was.

I found a honeywell timer on amazon, which requires being hard wired. There is no way my landlord would have let me do electrical work in my previous property, and getting an electrician out for a "simple" job like that is ~$80 plus $75 for the timer. A hue bridge + bulb is ~$75 and I can use my existing lamps too.

> You just needed to configure your latitude so it knew when sunset was.

Having an electrician hard wire an extra switch for each lamp, configuring latitude and individual timers (presumably they don't all work off the same trigger so if you want to change them from 30m before to an hour before, or 15m after you have to update them all), managing DST... That doesn't sound massively simple to be be honest.

> mechanical timers have been able to do this for decades.

I don't think people are claiming that smart homes are allowing for things that were never physically possible before; I'm certainly not, but it is definitely more convenient.

Re: The unbearable fussiness of the smart home

#95

Post by sixothree »

beardedwizard wrote: post #85
moffkalast wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hate to be the tiktok pokerface simple solution meme guy, but that's a solvable issue by just adding a RTC module, no complex internet garbage required.

Ah yes, the trivial to build, ultra simple crystal oscillator real time clock. Every hobbyist can just fab them right up, or just dig around in the garden to find a few.

I think he means it's a problem solvable by manufacturers that does not involve end user surveillance.

Re: The unbearable fussiness of the smart home

#96

Post by curiousllama »

markbnj wrote: post #86

Yeah over the last few weeks Alexa has grown annoyingly chatty. Pretty much every ask, like "Alexa, what's the outside temperature?" is followed by the answer and then "Did you know..." which is itself followed by me saying "Alexa stop" in an irritated voice. "Computer, lay in a course to intercept the Romulan cruiser." "Intercept course calculated. Did you know, I can automatically reorder toilet paper for the bridg…

Agreed that "did you know" sucks. Worst possible way to teach me to use the device.

That said, it's a really interesting problem figuring out how to teach people what Alexa can/can't do. How do you tell your users "we built a feature so now you can set subscription orders!"

Personally, I don't get why they don't run ads. Like, instead of a smiley face delivery person, just say "here's a new thing your Alexa can do"

Re: The unbearable fussiness of the smart home

#97

Post by ninkendo »

dotancohen wrote: post #57
ninkendo wrote: post #9

I did my whole house in Lutron’s smart switches (close to 50 of them), and I think it’s good? It’s been about 2 years now and I really haven’t had any issues. The switches aren’t Wi-Fi connected, because Wi-Fi would be an awful choice for 50 devices that you only communicate with a few times a day. They use their own wireless frequency and communicate in a really simple/reliable way to the bridge, which is wired to m…

> I did my whole house in Lutron’s smart switches Sure, but how do you turn the lights on when the power's out and the router is down? Lrf, V'z wbxvat.

I actually have a natural gas generator that powers the majority of the house, and I was happy to see the lights all worked fine during an outage when the internet was down along with the power. The switches all obviously worked, but the Home app worked too so I could continue to set scenes/etc. It was quite nice!

Re: The unbearable fussiness of the smart home

#98

Post by londons_explore »

everdrive wrote: post #7
h2odragon wrote: post #2

In that same time period, my "plant light" timer, a $15 mechanical item of a design unmodified since the 1970s, has worked flawlessly, requiring attention only when the clocks change or my schedule does. It has not informed Google, Amazon, or anyone else about its job or anything else in my home. It has generated no royalties nor invoked any support or ongoing maintenance costs. It has never needed a software upgrade…

I've got the same old-fashioned mechanical timer. I actually attached it to one of those "box fan filters" that people talk about here from time to time. (So I can filter on a schedule) It works perfectly, and I've never had any issues with it. I'm thoroughly convinced that if I tried to replace it with a "smart" device I'd have no shortage of issues. I like your thinking regarding the lack of reliability with these…

Whats needed is a much stronger guarantee. For example, "If this device ever, even once, shows an error message or misbehaves, then we'll give you a full refund, plus $100".

If there was some logo and brand associated with that guarantee, consumers would prefer it, just like today some only buy organic or freetrade. Then manufacturers would want the extra sales generated by that logo/brand, and have a massive financial incentive to only apply the logo when the product is good enough.

Re: The unbearable fussiness of the smart home

#99

Post by quickthrowman »

gwbas1c wrote: post #56
ninkendo wrote: post #9

I did my whole house in Lutron’s smart switches (close to 50 of them), and I think it’s good? It’s been about 2 years now and I really haven’t had any issues. The switches aren’t Wi-Fi connected, because Wi-Fi would be an awful choice for 50 devices that you only communicate with a few times a day. They use their own wireless frequency and communicate in a really simple/reliable way to the bridge, which is wired to m…

The thing that I like about the Lutron system is that you can try it, with just a single switch or lamp module. Then, if you like it, you can buy more. I previously used a different brand to control my aquarium lights and HATED it. When the app randomly made me enter my password to turn the lights on, I 1-starred it with a very frank, "my old-fashioned light switch doesn't randomly ask me to enter my password" in the…

> One complaint that I have about the Lutron system is that they don't offer relay-based modules.

Yes they do, here is the cutsheet: https://www.lutron.com/TechnicalDocumentLibrary/369-549b_Eng...

This one can switch 5A using a Pico input device.

Just to be clear, every commercial lighting controls line has relay modules, it’s necessary for occupancy sensing.

Re: The unbearable fussiness of the smart home

#100

Post by boringg »

Oh god I installed Nest fire alarm products throughout my home. Such a PAIN. Last 8 months at most before new batteries. Wireless updates kick it off the network all the effin time. Wish I could get my money back - now I am committed to this garbage product for at least 5 more years (if they last).

Worst - incredibly little value generated from nest.

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