Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The World's Deadliest Thing

the-angry-chef.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

221–230 of 231 posts

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#221

Post by fomine3 »

bluediscussy22 wrote: post #121
traceroute66 wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We hope so! Flash freezing kills parasites It depends where you are. If you are in a Western country, then yes, "sashimi grade fish" equals "frozen". If you are in Japan, then no. Its all to do with the understanding of fish and its handling. In the West its all commoditised, quantity over quality. In Japan, they have a deeply rooted fish culture, a focus on quality and are obsessive over food hygiene. So in Japan…

I live in Japan and some of this is a bit wrong. 1. All Tuna is frozen immediately after being caught on the boat - go to tsukiji (well now toyosu) at the tuna market. They are frozen and they taste better because of it. 2. There is no sushi / sashimi grade in Japan. High quality fish that you can eat safely is just the default 3. It's true that traditional sushi did not include salmon because of the parasites. If yo…

> 2. There is no sushi / sashimi grade in Japan. High quality fish that you can eat safely is just the default

Many fishes in supermarket are sold as "for heat cooking" except for sashimi. It's costly to make all salmon raw eatable.

Agree for others.

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#222

Post by spacechild1 »

AussieWog93 wrote: post #73
Stratoscope wrote: post #35

Pop quiz! Do you ever buy frozen vacuum-sealed fish? The kind where each piece is sealed in its own plastic pouch? It is convenient and delicious. To me it can taste fresher than some "fresh" fish. One reason is that the sealed pouch keeps oxygen out. Have you wondered why it says "remove all packaging before defrosting"? And ignored that advice like I did for many years? After all, the fish seems to defrost just fin…

Any people from developing countries reading this thread? What are your thoughts when you hear Westerners talking about the danger of leaving a meat out of the fridge for a couple of hours and stuff like that?

Huh? In Austrian supermarkets meat just lies in a cool counter and you ask the staff to cut you some pieces. Additionally, there would be some packed meat in a fridge. I think it's the same in most European countries, I guess?

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#223

Post by Helmut10001 »

weaksauce wrote: post #210
glenstein wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, that was going to be my question. Wouldn't botulism etc need a certain amount of time to grow? Is any normal use case of defrosting in a microwave long enough for that to happen? Is there a safe zone of X minutes, and then an unsafe zone of Y minutes where it gets dangerous?

it takes days for the botulism to grow under a vacuum in your fridge depending on temp.(a proper fridge should be 35-40F but many are much higher than that. 50F takes 2 days or so to form) https://www.riskyornot.co/episodes/34-thawing-frozen-fish-in...

I know - I was referring to other bacteria in your fridge (such as Listeria etc.)(not in your fridge particularly).

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#224

Post by dekhn »

foobarian wrote: post #181
raisedbyninjas wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are botulism spores found inside meat or just the surface? 85C in the center will overcook the meats I cook.

Not inside meat, no. I don't think it's a problem for run of the mill hot-smoking or BBQ. For cold-smoked stuff I don't dare eat it raw yet but use the meat in stews. Cold smoked pork ribs add a 3rd dimension to thick soups like pasta fagioli or split pea soup, while sausages are great fried. I don't know how to safely attempt a prosciutto or lox though :-)

cured lox is easy, it's just a salt and sugar brine (cold smoked is something entirely different). If the salinity and sugar are high enough basically nothing can grow. Salt on its own, sugar on its own don't worry very well.

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#225

Post by dekhn »

technothrasher wrote: post #152
traceroute66 wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> American cheese on fish is gross American cheese is gross full stop. ;-) As is American chocolate.

> As is American chocolate. You've been eating the wrong American chocolate. Hershey's isn't the end all and be all. There are plenty of good chocolate makers and even more good chocolatiers in the US, you just need to explore a bit. L.A. Burdick in New Hampshire, for example, makes really great chocolates, and has a nice wide range of single source bars made with beans from plantations all over the world.

true of cheese as well. Tillamook in Oregon produces fantastic cheese (which is widely vended). The way I think about it is that the average american food is poorer than average european quality, but that our best producers make some of the best in the world.

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#226

Post by mdavis6890 »

chadcmulligan wrote: post #46
asguy wrote: post #9

Only two mentions of 'nitrites'? Botulism is the reason we started curing meats with nitrite and nitrate in the first place. Canning is fine, but being able to keep meat at room temperature by just adding common (e.g. available in urine, and celery) chemicals is far more interesting.

so does ham cured with celery also contain nitrites? I've been buying free range ham cured with celery because I thought it was free of nitrites.

Why are you avoiding nitrites? As far as I can tell they are inert and safe.

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#227

Post by alienthrowaway »

AussieWog93 wrote: post #73
Stratoscope wrote: post #35

Pop quiz! Do you ever buy frozen vacuum-sealed fish? The kind where each piece is sealed in its own plastic pouch? It is convenient and delicious. To me it can taste fresher than some "fresh" fish. One reason is that the sealed pouch keeps oxygen out. Have you wondered why it says "remove all packaging before defrosting"? And ignored that advice like I did for many years? After all, the fish seems to defrost just fin…

Any people from developing countries reading this thread? What are your thoughts when you hear Westerners talking about the danger of leaving a meat out of the fridge for a couple of hours and stuff like that?

I think it's weird how the US put offloads most of the responsibility for preventing diseases to the supply chain and buyer, and not closer to the source. Lack of refrigerated trucks and unreliable power supply means we cannot rely on temperature being kept below specific temperatures. As a result, the regulations, processing and packaging are all work in tandem for safe food these conditions,e.g. regulations on how animals are reared, transported slaughtered, pasteurization and vacuum packaging. As an example, there are multiple brands of milk that's shelf-stable for months at room temperature.

> What are your thoughts when you hear Westerners talking about the danger of leaving a meat out of the fridge for a couple of hours and stuff like that?

It's not any different from the anywhere in the world, you have to be careful about how you handle food, or you will have a bad time.

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#228

Post by SixDouble5321 »

enlyth wrote: post #19
gnulinux wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just click reader mode in Firefox.

I'm not going to install a different browser to read one article

Lol, people were just assuming you were using the correct browser for this day and age. Don't be so obtuse.

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#230

Post by urthor »

FishGuy wrote: post #170
urthor wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't practically everything you see in a fish market flash frozen anyway? Afaik there's very little fresh fish going around, period. It's all frozen on the boat.

At least in the US, a significant amount of the fish you eat in high end restaurants, sushi restaurants and fish markets is never frozen. It is packed in ice and kept very cold, but not frozen. Supermarkets are more likely to stock frozen/previously frozen. Lots of commodity seafood is frozen when caught. Source: Spent a season offshore fishing for swordfish/tuna. Worked in the warehouses that unloaded and shipped th…

Ah, the more you know. Fish guy has spoken I guess.

At least for white fish.

Post reply on HN