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I’m leaving London for NYC and taking my tech startup

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Re: I’m leaving London for NYC and taking my tech startup

#121

Post by hogFeast »

Quarrelsome wrote: post #108
ed_balls wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to work for a startup founded by a few Brits. We had engineers in London, but no sales people, because of the culture. I was much easier to sell to Walmart than Tesco.

like the author we're light on details beyond "the culture", "bad at sales". What does this _mean_ exactly?

It is everything.

Customers too risk-averse, class boundaries still endemic (it is amazing the US tech companies went into this, Google/Facebook/etc. seem to have hired the Notting Hill set as soon as they came to London), companies too conservative about investing margin in sales, very relationship-driven sales culture (as opposed to product-driven) that is closed to "outsiders", reluctance to cold-call, etc.

It is cultural because it can be anything else, do people from the UK have a different biology? No. I think if you look at politics in the UK, it is self-evident that the culture of the UK is not exactly entrepreneurial...unless you believe that a group of probably 30-50 people who went to the same school, went to the same university and largely studied the same course should rule the country...it is very weird.

Re: I’m leaving London for NYC and taking my tech startup

#122

Post by hogFeast »

selimthegrim wrote: post #118
hogFeast wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The commercial culture in the UK is, generally, nothing like the US. You have companies with great products that refuse on principle to hire lots of salespeople. I actually can't think of a SaaS company that is as aggressive in investing in sales and marketing as you see on average in the US. And this is rational because the return on investment is usually very poor (fintech in the UK is probably the best example, su…

>I studied somewhere that was doing AI research back in the 60s Edinburgh?

Yes. Still a great uni but known more for the people who studied and went elsewhere than the people who stayed (in AI).

Re: I’m leaving London for NYC and taking my tech startup

#123

Post by exdsq »

busterarm wrote: post #101
exdsq wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moving to the US from Europe isn't that easy. I only made the move because my wife is a postdoc over here, but with things like H1-B freezes and covid-19 it can be very difficult to do.

I've worked with a lot of Europeans and overwhelmingly they are not on H-1B visas. Green cards, L-1, O-1 and spouse visas are the way to go. Getting an O-1 visa in the software space is a lot easier than you think, especially with the way the software industry works in Europe (it's a much smaller pool with a higher average level of education and way more public speaking & publishing opportunities) in general the requ…

I'm on a J2 and think I can progress onto another one if I decide to stay in a couple years (via a work sponsorship). Saying this, Green Cards are obviously crazy difficult to get without already living in the US for years and O-1 visas are also really difficult to get. L-1's work if you're at a large company but not if you're working for startups.

Re: I’m leaving London for NYC and taking my tech startup

#124

Post by standardUser »

brianmcc wrote: post #67
c7DJTLrn wrote: post #43

Sounds like the author is upset that Brexit has closed the valve on the pipeline of cheap labour from EU workers. There's no shortage of talent in London trust me, it's just that you're going to have to start paying more than a pittance to get it. Brexit so far has been a positive thing for tech workers' salaries.

"cheap EU labour" tends to apply more to fruit pickers than AI PhDs I suspect

Tech salaries in continental Europe are significantly lower than in the US or UK. Even the most highly developed economies like Germany and Denmark often provide 50% of what you might make in CA or NY for a similar role.

Re: I’m leaving London for NYC and taking my tech startup

#125

Post by liuyipei »

setgree wrote: post #42

> Advances in the type of small data AI we do — AI created without vast data sets — would have only been possible here in Europe , with its deep and diverse technical and mathematical talent. This would have been difficult in Silicon Valley given US tech’s reluctance to experiment and innovate , beyond the conventional “big data AI” approach. Can anyone expand on what the author is saying here/validate it with person…

He is talking about work that involves a deep understanding of the domain and data, on smaller datasets that require a lot more framing to make sense of.

I understand the author to be saying that "small data AI" activities as a fraction of all AI work in the US is lower, because in the US it is so much easier to make more money doing big-data work instead.

Re: I’m leaving London for NYC and taking my tech startup

#126

Post by TheSpiceIsLife »

eganist wrote: post #32
jgrahamc wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, good luck to him moving his HQ to NYC etc. but if I were an employee in London HM The Queen's tea cup in Windsor would be shaking from the sonic boom after I lit the reheats on my CV.

> I mean, good luck to him moving his HQ to NYC etc. but if I were an employee in London HM The Queen's tea cup in Windsor would be shaking from the sonic boom after I lit the reheats on my CV. I wish I lived in London just to use this expressive nugget of gold.

Gold.

The Epstein Drive[1] method of finding a new job.

1. https://expanse.fandom.com/wiki/Epstein_Drive

Re: I’m leaving London for NYC and taking my tech startup

#127

Post by eggy »

Hopefully crime goes back down. I was born and raised in Brooklyn during some of NY's worst crime waves. It appears to be heading back that way again with inflation and crime. Felonious assaults are up over 18% since 2020, and robbery is up by 15.8% compared to 2020. His startup sounds like any other tech-based company. He needs techs, mathematicians, AI, data sci., etc. With the great work-from-home experiment due to COVID, and tech not really needing to be physically present in NYC, why move there for the high rents and cost of living? I ran a business in the tri-state area for 9 years, but I catered to artists and shows, manufacturing, and designed and built physical objects with tech interfaces or controls. I had to be in the area. Now I do more consultation, design, and engineering and I work around the world from a nice NY town 45 to 60 min. from NYC on the Hudson. Wouldn't go back to NYC if you paid me. Thinking on going back to live in the rice fields of Indonesia or another bucolic place to enjoy my family more in a nice environment, if I can swing it.

Re: I’m leaving London for NYC and taking my tech startup

#128

Post by chrisseaton »

eggy wrote: post #127

Hopefully crime goes back down. I was born and raised in Brooklyn during some of NY's worst crime waves. It appears to be heading back that way again with inflation and crime. Felonious assaults are up over 18% since 2020, and robbery is up by 15.8% compared to 2020. His startup sounds like any other tech-based company. He needs techs, mathematicians, AI, data sci., etc. With the great work-from-home experiment due t…

> since 2020

Isn’t that just because nobody was out on the streets in 2020?

Re: I’m leaving London for NYC and taking my tech startup

#129

Post by [deleted] »

jgrahamc wrote: post #28
KaiserPro wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

London does sales well, if you want a sales office you open it in london. What it doesn't do well is spaff money indiscriminately at any old idiot with an idea. Even less so to someone with a crap idea. Despite the article author's claim, most of the startups in the generation that I joined (2018+) have focused on getting a decent business model, rather than hyper growth above all else. They also had to do much more…

I mean, good luck to him moving his HQ to NYC etc. but if I were an employee in London HM The Queen's tea cup in Windsor would be shaking from the sonic boom after I lit the reheats on my CV.

[deleted]

Re: I’m leaving London for NYC and taking my tech startup

#130

Post by ulfw »

standardUser wrote: post #124
brianmcc wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"cheap EU labour" tends to apply more to fruit pickers than AI PhDs I suspect

Tech salaries in continental Europe are significantly lower than in the US or UK. Even the most highly developed economies like Germany and Denmark often provide 50% of what you might make in CA or NY for a similar role.

But not 50% of what you might make in London and that's what this is about.

And the EUR goes a lot farther in say Berlin than the GBP goes in London these days (see rent, eating out prices etc)

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