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California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

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Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#51

Post by sieabahlpark »

zozbot234 wrote: post #19
hanniabu wrote: post #3

Well that's stupid. If anything they should introduce it sooner. There's tons of research that show the sooner it's introduced the better they are able to digest that (as in it becomes more second nature and are later able to reason with it and build off that knowledge better).

It's hard to introduce Algebra much earlier than 8th grade - the students just don't have the mathematical maturity for it. What you can do though is challenge and expose them to slightly more complex applications of ordinary math (often stated via increasingly elaborate "word problems") that make the introduction of algebra a lot more natural when the students are finally up for it. You tend to see this approach in…

No one said earlier than 8th, they're commenting on earlier than 9th.

There are going to be some dumb kids coming out of California.

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#53

Post by anm89 »

_-david-_ wrote: post #25

If racism is actually causing blacks and Hispanics to not make it into advanced classes then why are Asians making it in?

They are clearly excelling at math just to be racist.

Also my brother's Chinese wife is on faculty at an Ivy League school and she was explicitly informed that when discussing diversity issues, she is white.

The mind boggles

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#54

Post by darth_avocado »

nottorp wrote: post #40
darth_avocado wrote: post #14

Here's a revolutionary idea that pretty much all of the world adopts, if students are having trouble with a topic, get them to do more of it, instead of running away from it. I always find it hilarious that the pre college education in US is so messed up. Instead of doing Algebra 1, Algebra 2, calculus, geometry as one subject that you do in a year and then completely forgetting about it till the next time you have t…

> I always find it hilarious that the pre college education in US is so messed up. Instead of doing Algebra 1, Algebra 2, calculus, geometry as one subject that you do in a year and then completely forgetting about it for the rest of the high school, how about you do a little bit of everything every year from grade 8-12. Problem solved. I don't understand. US high school kids only do math one year out of the 4? And n…

No they do math every year, it's just not well designed so that each topic is spread evenly. [Updated the wording to make it more clear]

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#55

Post by tomatofarmer »

ng12 wrote: post #21

> applies social justice principles to math lessons. ... huh? Does anyone know what this looks like?

They teach that math is subjective. Objectivity is the corner stone of white supremacy.

> "The concept of mathematics being purely objective is unequivocally false, and teaching it is even much less so. Upholding the idea that there are always right and wrong answers perpetuate objectivity as well as fear of open conflict."

https://equitablemath.org/

https://www.newsweek.com/math-suffers-white-supremacy-accord...

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#56

Post by bko »

This is one of those issues that I can't understand the opposing argument. It's just an issue I find so objectionable that I cannot understand why anyone would be imposing this. Literally holding kids back.

The only defense I hear is that kids don't really benefit from advanced classes and they'll be fine anyway. But gifted children will not necessarily be fine. Most of the smartest people I know struggled in school just, but most were fortunately saved by advanced placement classes that put them in classes where they can learn at a faster pace than the rest of the children. Were they forced to stay in what to them amounted to remedial classes, they would grow to resent education and actually underperform.

The utter disregard the people pushing these policies have for children is appalling. Hopefully this is just a weird time in our countries history where that we'll look back on and think how absurd the policies were.

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#57

Post by zozbot234 »

pineconewarrior wrote: post #29
zozbot234 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's hard to introduce Algebra much earlier than 8th grade - the students just don't have the mathematical maturity for it. What you can do though is challenge and expose them to slightly more complex applications of ordinary math (often stated via increasingly elaborate "word problems") that make the introduction of algebra a lot more natural when the students are finally up for it. You tend to see this approach in…

Seems entirely arbitrary (if not false?). I was taught the basics of algebra and even trig (at least, how pi and radians work) in the 4th and 5th grade

Yes, but I'm talking about what works well for the average student, not just math whizs who post on HN.

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#58

Post by [deleted] »

zozbot234 wrote: post #19
hanniabu wrote: post #3

Well that's stupid. If anything they should introduce it sooner. There's tons of research that show the sooner it's introduced the better they are able to digest that (as in it becomes more second nature and are later able to reason with it and build off that knowledge better).

It's hard to introduce Algebra much earlier than 8th grade - the students just don't have the mathematical maturity for it. What you can do though is challenge and expose them to slightly more complex applications of ordinary math (often stated via increasingly elaborate "word problems") that make the introduction of algebra a lot more natural when the students are finally up for it. You tend to see this approach in…

[deleted]

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#59

Post by ramesh31 »

nottorp wrote: post #40
darth_avocado wrote: post #14

Here's a revolutionary idea that pretty much all of the world adopts, if students are having trouble with a topic, get them to do more of it, instead of running away from it. I always find it hilarious that the pre college education in US is so messed up. Instead of doing Algebra 1, Algebra 2, calculus, geometry as one subject that you do in a year and then completely forgetting about it till the next time you have t…

> I always find it hilarious that the pre college education in US is so messed up. Instead of doing Algebra 1, Algebra 2, calculus, geometry as one subject that you do in a year and then completely forgetting about it for the rest of the high school, how about you do a little bit of everything every year from grade 8-12. Problem solved. I don't understand. US high school kids only do math one year out of the 4? And n…

Math in US high schools ends at what most countries would consider a middle school level. Algebra 2 is generally the only requirement. The vast majority of students graduate without ever even knowing what calculus is.

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#60

Post by sharken »

hprotagonist wrote: post #11

"Yet for all the sound and fury, the proposed framework, about 800-pages long, is little more than a set of suggestions. Its designers are revising it now and will subject it to 60 more days of public review. Once it’s approved in July, districts may adopt as much or as little of the framework as they choose — and can disregard it completely without any penalty."

Sounds like a huge waste of taxpayers money, the silver lining is that sensible schools can disregard this bad idea altogether.
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