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The Catherine Project: A new experiment in liberal education

hedgehogreview.com

61–70 of 198 posts

Re: The Catherine Project: A new experiment in liberal education

#61
Interesting to see the deep skepticism in the comments.

I attended St John's College - which is probably as close as a "real" school can get to the Catherine Project - and loved every minute. Grades were not given, and there were no professors or lectures.

Seeing criticism about the business model and lack of tests, worry about educational fads, etc, is missing the point, in my opinion.

Consider the possibility that a group of adults may want to engage in rich and historically important works of thought, but have no interest in the trappings of educational institutions, with their tuition, grades, etc. Like a bible study, but without the bible. If you feel threatened by this, ask yourself why.

Re: The Catherine Project: A new experiment in liberal education

#62
post #47
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Marx was not writing a plan of action, and all that has been proved is that authoritarian assholes are assholes. No - what has been proved is that Marx’s theories don’t limit the effects of the machinations of assholes. If there is one thing a political system should do, it is this. > I take if you also think Adam Smith should be discarded because parts of "Inquiry into the Wealth of Nations" doesn't map well to mo…

> what has been proved is that Marx’s theories don’t limit the effects of the machinations of assholes What a weird test. No system of government does, and Marx was not writing a system of government. I guess it is time to throw out all political theory, though. > that we shouldn’t be claiming that Adam smith has written a prescription Funny, the people making that claim about Marx are equally wrong, and yet you want…

> What a weird test. No system of government does

I’m surprised you don’t think it’s important for power to be accountable. It’s ok if you don’t, but I think limiting the power of tyrants is an important political principle.

>> that we shouldn’t be claiming that Adam smith has written a prescription

> Funny, the people making that claim about Marx are equally wrong, and yet you want to discard all of it.

Who said it should all be discarded? It seems like you might be remembering a past argument with someone else.

>> and not fetishizing

> I'm not the one with the fetish here.

Ok, I’ll bite. What do you think I’m fetishizing?

Re: The Catherine Project: A new experiment in liberal education

#63
An outlandish new venture in liberal education. What about conservative education?

"We have no agenda to indoctrinate people in any particular set of social or political values."

and

"We’ve explored complex moral issues like when manipulation is justified..."

Re: The Catherine Project: A new experiment in liberal education

#64
When I first moved to the San Francisco Bay Area, my husband drove the family to see San Francisco one day. It was the most beautiful and inspiring big city I had ever seen.

We stopped at the bookstore on the way home and I bought a bunch of books related to my interest in urban planning and read them while convalescing. One book was a collection of excerpts from various urban planning tomes. Another was a book called Seeing like a state. Another was about The Clemente Course in Humanities.

https://www.clementecourse.org/

To me, community development is about the people more than the buildings or infrastructure. Those things are not unimportant, but they need to serve the people. So I was also interested in the psychology of how the state relates to the needs of the people and how you develop human capital.

Human capital is developed in part with education. Jobs and other social connections also matter but education is one of the things that tends to separate the privileged from the underprivileged.

When I homeschooled my sons, I used to talk in online forums about teaching my kids a humanities education and defined it as being about learning to effectively cope with the inconvenient, inescapable fact of one's own humanity.

Humanities also gets called Liberal Arts. In spite of its current poor reputation, Liberal Arts was so named because the idea was that it was education that was empowering and freeing. It was, in a word, liberating.

My dream college back when I was a teenager, that I never got to attend, has a Great Books curriculum.

https://www.sjc.edu/

Re: The Catherine Project: A new experiment in liberal education

#65

Has anyone ever stopped to consider the ethical question of applying the latest unproven fads of educational theory to unwitting students? Ideally before large scale rollouts? As someone who grew up during a tumultuous time for the public education system in Ontario, Canada, it felt like ever year or two whole curriculums were thrown out and the latest and greatest "cutting edge" approaches and fads were foisted upon…

Honestly, what they described in the article seemed less experimental and more grounded in tradition than a lot of the current teachings in the humanities.

Re: The Catherine Project: A new experiment in liberal education

#66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of the things you learned under pressure of exams and grades, how many of them do you actually remember? That is, did you learn for long enough to pass the test, or did you learn ?

Is it controversial/surprising to say that one would learn more from studying than not studying?

False dichotomy. What you call "not studying" would vary between effectively dropping out (for the people who are only at uni to get drunk and end up with a degree at the end), gaining a more thorough holistic understand of the material, or diving really deep on some of the aspects that are most interesting at the cost of others.

The drink-and-get-a-certificate people will indeed profit from being encouraged to study, but the controversial opinion here would be that university should only or mainly care about those.

Re: The Catherine Project: A new experiment in liberal education

#67
post #61

Interesting to see the deep skepticism in the comments. I attended St John's College - which is probably as close as a "real" school can get to the Catherine Project - and loved every minute. Grades were not given, and there were no professors or lectures. Seeing criticism about the business model and lack of tests, worry about educational fads, etc, is missing the point, in my opinion. Consider the possibility that…

I'm guessing you mean this St. John's:

https://www.sjc.edu/

(If so: Color me jealous.)

Re: The Catherine Project: A new experiment in liberal education

#68
post #61

Interesting to see the deep skepticism in the comments. I attended St John's College - which is probably as close as a "real" school can get to the Catherine Project - and loved every minute. Grades were not given, and there were no professors or lectures. Seeing criticism about the business model and lack of tests, worry about educational fads, etc, is missing the point, in my opinion. Consider the possibility that…

I'm guessing you mean this St. John's: https://www.sjc.edu/ (If so: Color me jealous.)

That's the one! They have a graduate program that you can participate in part-time...something to consider!

Re: The Catherine Project: A new experiment in liberal education

#69

> Since education rather than money is calling the shots, we have the freedom to ask unheard-of questions. Who is paying the bills, then? > no grades There's a reason why students cram at the end of the semester. Without pressure from grades, they won't do the work of learning. I know for a fact that I don't learn if there aren't exams and grades.

> Without pressure from grades, they won't do the work of learning.

Then why do you suppose people read books in their free time?

Re: The Catherine Project: A new experiment in liberal education

#70
post #55
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an oft-repeated nonsense line to dismiss some really interesting philosophy. Marx was not writing a plan of action, and all that has been proved is that authoritarian assholes are assholes. (I take if you also think Adam Smith should be discarded because parts of "Inquiry into the Wealth of Nations" doesn't map well to modern capitalism?) Here's a real test of a free thinker. Are you willing to read "dangerou…

> Marx was not writing a plan of action, and all that has been proved is that authoritarian assholes are assholes. The Communist manifesto is literally a plan of action . It calls for an authoritarian government in which all financial assets, credit, real assets, and land are centralized and controlled by the state. It calls for seizure of all personal property of anyone who wants to leave the country. It calls for c…

Given that this comment is almost all a direct quote of Marx himself, and is otherwise an entirely factual and non-judgmental statement, it is curious to see it downvoted so heavily.

It’s especially odd, given that this thread is about whether or not we should read Marx. I’m very curious about who thinks this should be downvoted and why?

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