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The World's Deadliest Thing

the-angry-chef.com

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Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#121

Post by bluediscussy22 »

traceroute66 wrote: post #111
raverbashing wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We hope so! Flash freezing kills parasites (Sure, it's not an issue if you cook it thoroughly before consumption, but still)

> We hope so! Flash freezing kills parasites It depends where you are. If you are in a Western country, then yes, "sashimi grade fish" equals "frozen". If you are in Japan, then no. Its all to do with the understanding of fish and its handling. In the West its all commoditised, quantity over quality. In Japan, they have a deeply rooted fish culture, a focus on quality and are obsessive over food hygiene. So in Japan…

I live in Japan and some of this is a bit wrong.

1. All Tuna is frozen immediately after being caught on the boat - go to tsukiji (well now toyosu) at the tuna market. They are frozen and they taste better because of it.

2. There is no sushi / sashimi grade in Japan. High quality fish that you can eat safely is just the default

3. It's true that traditional sushi did not include salmon because of the parasites. If you go to a traditional sushi restaurant (3 star Michelin etc) you won't find salmon nigiri. Other than that salmon sushi is everywhere at sushi restaurants in Japan and tons of Japanese eat salmon nigiri and sushi.

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#122

Post by 2-718-281-828 »

dustintrex wrote: post #65
Stratoscope wrote: post #35

Pop quiz! Do you ever buy frozen vacuum-sealed fish? The kind where each piece is sealed in its own plastic pouch? It is convenient and delicious. To me it can taste fresher than some "fresh" fish. One reason is that the sealed pouch keeps oxygen out. Have you wondered why it says "remove all packaging before defrosting"? And ignored that advice like I did for many years? After all, the fish seems to defrost just fin…

Is this really a risk in practice though? I can't find any cases of this actually happening on the CDC's botulism site: https://www.cdc.gov/botulism/surveillance.html

might become a risk if it lies around defrosted for many hours.

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#123

Post by nkrisc »

traceroute66 wrote: post #94
Stratoscope wrote: post #35

Pop quiz! Do you ever buy frozen vacuum-sealed fish? The kind where each piece is sealed in its own plastic pouch? It is convenient and delicious. To me it can taste fresher than some "fresh" fish. One reason is that the sealed pouch keeps oxygen out. Have you wondered why it says "remove all packaging before defrosting"? And ignored that advice like I did for many years? After all, the fish seems to defrost just fin…

> Do you ever buy frozen vacuum-sealed fish? The kind where each piece is sealed in its own plastic pouch? It is convenient and delicious. To me it can taste fresher than some "fresh" fish. Eeew. No. Call me old-fashioned but I believe in this thing called seasonality. I only buy fish that is in season, not farmed, and that is genuinely fresh from reputable suppliers, not supermarket "fresh". Nice clear bright eyes,…

Unless you’re buying your fish every morning in the fish market at the harbor, it’s probably been frozen. Even wild caught is typically frozen as soon as it’s hauled aboard.

This will vary around the world, of course.

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#124

Post by ckastner »

dustintrex wrote: post #65
Stratoscope wrote: post #35

Pop quiz! Do you ever buy frozen vacuum-sealed fish? The kind where each piece is sealed in its own plastic pouch? It is convenient and delicious. To me it can taste fresher than some "fresh" fish. One reason is that the sealed pouch keeps oxygen out. Have you wondered why it says "remove all packaging before defrosting"? And ignored that advice like I did for many years? After all, the fish seems to defrost just fin…

Is this really a risk in practice though? I can't find any cases of this actually happening on the CDC's botulism site: https://www.cdc.gov/botulism/surveillance.html

I am somewhat skeptical of this as well. It's not uncommon to hear of someone having eaten something "bad", but that can be the result of many pathogens and with regards to botulinum, the article gives a data point:

> In the UK, between 1990 and 2005, there were 5 reported cases affecting 6 people and causing 2 deaths, meaning that you were 15 times more likely to be hit by lightning.

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#125

Post by mejutoco »

Stratoscope wrote: post #106
urthor wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't practically everything you see in a fish market flash frozen anyway? Afaik there's very little fresh fish going around, period. It's all frozen on the boat.

A friend told me that he never, ever eats frozen fish, but he does enjoy all varieties of sushi and sashimi, and he explained to me that those are never frozen. I tried to convince him otherwise, but never got anywhere. https://www.seriouseats.com/how-to-prepare-raw-fish-at-home-...

In some places it is illegal _not_ to freeze the fish for sushi, to avoid anisakis (I don't know how it is enforced, though).

source: https://elpais.com/sociedad/2006/12/20/actualidad/1166569202...

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#126

Post by 2-718-281-828 »

bambax wrote: post #60
turbinerneiter wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I defrost my fish in the package by putting it in hot tap water. You, sire, drastically reduced my chance of dying. Thank you very much.

Do not do that. Defrosting should be done slowly in the fridge. Or you can cook frozen food directly. But do not defrost at or about room temperature, this will breed bacteria like crazy.

defrosting in cold tap water also works just fine. I noticed that this keeps the fibres and cells intact which is advantageous for frying afterwards as the filet won't fall apart so easily.

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#127

Post by sdfghderwg »

chadcmulligan wrote: post #64
d136o wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just listened to a podcast episode about this, basically celery cured just means “naturally found” nitrites… which are the same thing as artificial nitrites… they’re just nitrites. (Disclaimer: not a chemist) https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/stuff-you-should-know/...

Well thats disappointing

I always found it intriguing that some people can have the discipline to make big changes to their day to day routine based on some learned trivia, but don't have the discipline to actually learn the subject.

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#128

Post by ckastner »

nkrisc wrote: post #123
traceroute66 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do you ever buy frozen vacuum-sealed fish? The kind where each piece is sealed in its own plastic pouch? It is convenient and delicious. To me it can taste fresher than some "fresh" fish. Eeew. No. Call me old-fashioned but I believe in this thing called seasonality. I only buy fish that is in season, not farmed, and that is genuinely fresh from reputable suppliers, not supermarket "fresh". Nice clear bright eyes,…

Unless you’re buying your fish every morning in the fish market at the harbor, it’s probably been frozen. Even wild caught is typically frozen as soon as it’s hauled aboard. This will vary around the world, of course.

Supposedly, flash freezing (which is distinct from your average home freezer unit) preserves quality such that even trained sushi chefs can't tell the difference between fresh and previously flash-frozen fish.

https://www.nytimes.com/2004/04/08/nyregion/sushi-fresh-from...

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#129

Post by koheripbal »

ckastner wrote: post #124
dustintrex wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this really a risk in practice though? I can't find any cases of this actually happening on the CDC's botulism site: https://www.cdc.gov/botulism/surveillance.html

I am somewhat skeptical of this as well. It's not uncommon to hear of someone having eaten something "bad", but that can be the result of many pathogens and with regards to botulinum, the article gives a data point: > In the UK, between 1990 and 2005, there were 5 reported cases affecting 6 people and causing 2 deaths, meaning that you were 15 times more likely to be hit by lightning.

That data is clearly only reporting very serious cases though, since one third of them died.

Food poisoning is much more common than lightning.

Re: The World's Deadliest Thing

#130

Post by koheripbal »

traceroute66 wrote: post #94
Stratoscope wrote: post #35

Pop quiz! Do you ever buy frozen vacuum-sealed fish? The kind where each piece is sealed in its own plastic pouch? It is convenient and delicious. To me it can taste fresher than some "fresh" fish. One reason is that the sealed pouch keeps oxygen out. Have you wondered why it says "remove all packaging before defrosting"? And ignored that advice like I did for many years? After all, the fish seems to defrost just fin…

> Do you ever buy frozen vacuum-sealed fish? The kind where each piece is sealed in its own plastic pouch? It is convenient and delicious. To me it can taste fresher than some "fresh" fish. Eeew. No. Call me old-fashioned but I believe in this thing called seasonality. I only buy fish that is in season, not farmed, and that is genuinely fresh from reputable suppliers, not supermarket "fresh". Nice clear bright eyes,…

Many of those frozen like that were flash frozen on the boat and are fresher than even what you buy at the fish market direct from the boats that landed that night.
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