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The Stroad

strongtowns.org

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Re: The Stroad

#31

Post by kryogen1c »

wffurr wrote: post #6
mcv wrote: post #3

I don't think this article is making the point veey clearly, but it is a very important point: roads are for long distance connections at speed, streets are for local traffic: reaching houses, shops, people. These stroads try to do both and fail at both because the goals are contradictory; you can't have high speed traffic with lots of side streets and crossing traffic, bikes and pedestrians. It will be too slow for…

Every time I end up on a five lane road with the center turning lane and tons of curb cuts and cross streets and abutting parking lots, I remind myself that it's one of the most dangerous places I am likely to be in.

> one of the most dangerous places I am likely to be in.

i dont know how widely this turn of phrase is used, but where i grew up in the US, we called the middle turn lane in a 5 lane road the suicide lane.

Re: The Stroad

#32

Post by josephcsible »

throw0101a wrote: post #22
josephcsible wrote: post #2

This feels like saying that we should only have supercomputers and low-power embedded devices, and nothing in between such as regular desktop computers.

It's saying that currently only desktop computers are being built, and they're being shoehorned into both supercomputer applications (modelling weather) and embedded areas (controlling a lightbulb via a Dell OptiPlex). Having two classes of devices would be an improvement of the current situation.

But it's not the case that only stroads are being built. There's plenty of things that are unambiguously streets and plenty of things that are unambiguously roads. If the argument were "not everything should be a stroad", I'd agree, but they're saying they want to eradicate all stroads.

Re: The Stroad

#33

Post by jschwartzi »

maxerickson wrote: post #20
novok wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't live on a road, you either live on a street or stroad. A road by definition does not have building access. Maybe your backyard faces a road, but you couldn't drive onto it with a car from there.

That isn't the popular definition of a road, at least not in the US.

The US definition sucks.

Re: The Stroad

#34

Post by onionisafruit »

chestervonwinch wrote: post #11
wffurr wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every time I end up on a five lane road with the center turning lane and tons of curb cuts and cross streets and abutting parking lots, I remind myself that it's one of the most dangerous places I am likely to be in.

Here in Austin Texas, we have lovely signs to remind you of your imminent crash! http://austintexas.gov/sites/default/files/files/Sign%201.JP...

I don’t remember ever seeing that sign. Where is it posted?

Re: The Stroad

#35

Post by SantalBlush »

kryogen1c wrote: post #31
wffurr wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every time I end up on a five lane road with the center turning lane and tons of curb cuts and cross streets and abutting parking lots, I remind myself that it's one of the most dangerous places I am likely to be in.

> one of the most dangerous places I am likely to be in. i dont know how widely this turn of phrase is used, but where i grew up in the US, we called the middle turn lane in a 5 lane road the suicide lane.

I've also called it that for as long as I can remember, and it's probably helped me drive more defensively around that lane. Drivers misuse it all the time.

Re: The Stroad

#36

Post by eggsmediumrare »

kryogen1c wrote: post #31
wffurr wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every time I end up on a five lane road with the center turning lane and tons of curb cuts and cross streets and abutting parking lots, I remind myself that it's one of the most dangerous places I am likely to be in.

> one of the most dangerous places I am likely to be in. i dont know how widely this turn of phrase is used, but where i grew up in the US, we called the middle turn lane in a 5 lane road the suicide lane.

Likewise in Ontario. Strong term, but gets the point across. I also once saw a dump truck with stickers on either side of the tailgate. On the left, "passing side." On the right, "suicide." Had a big impact on my driving habits... I never, ever pass on the right.

Re: The Stroad

#37

Post by maxerickson »

jschwartzi wrote: post #33
maxerickson wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That isn't the popular definition of a road, at least not in the US.

The US definition sucks.

Okay, great, we've really moved the conversation forward here.

The vague implication, that 2-lane state and federal highways shouldn't have driveways on them, is not and will not be the situation for the foreseeable future, so there's a pretty good case for using some nuance instead of insisting on some particular technical definition.

Re: The Stroad

#38

Post by jschwartzi »

kmeisthax wrote: post #7
josephcsible wrote: post #2

This feels like saying that we should only have supercomputers and low-power embedded devices, and nothing in between such as regular desktop computers.

No, a stroad is more like trying to do supercomputing tasks on a Raspberry Pi. Except you also expect it to get ridiculous perf/watt despite running at it's highest performance band all of the time. Oh, and you're also overclocking the Pi to the point that it explodes. The point they're trying to make isn't "you should only have tiny side streets and massive highways, with nothing in between". It's "don't build roads…

The other point that’s being missed here is that pedestrians need a bunch of stuff that’s ignored:

* to be able to walk from business to business in minutes or seconds * to feel safe walking across the street * to be able to have conversations with other people outside without having to yell over traffic.

The stroad is also really bad at providing these needs because pedestrians are not considered at all in US roadway design.

Re: The Stroad

#39

Post by wilkommen »

josephcsible wrote: post #2

This feels like saying that we should only have supercomputers and low-power embedded devices, and nothing in between such as regular desktop computers.

No, it's saying that we need to use the right tool for the right job. It's about kind, not degree. When you lay asphalt on the ground there should be clear purpose - am I making a place for people to live and for commerce to occur or am I making a way for people to travel from one place to another place? If the latter, allow no intersections and allow for high speed vehicular travel. If the former, prioritize making the place that you're creating a nice place to be - things like wide sidewalks, tree cover, easy to walk around, low speed vehicular traffic for pedestrian safety and comfort, etc. If you are unclear about for which purpose you're laying asphalt, you end up creating something that is a sucky place to be and also moves traffic really slowly. You get something that sucks at everything.

Re: The Stroad

#40

Post by rnantes »

Transportation and housing are intrinsically linked with affordability and quality of life. For North American society to improve we need to address these issues.
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