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Clean Streets: People taking San Francisco’s trash into their own hands

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Re: Clean Streets: People taking San Francisco’s trash into their own hands

#111

Post by Teever »

computerphage wrote: post #103
_jal wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to clean up near my front door, but it became overwhelming. I live in a "bad" part of SF, by choice - I have a huge, cheap apartment. Until about 5 or so years ago, the homeless situation was not that bad around me. There would be periods where people with problems would be around, but generally it wasn't a big deal. I'd clean up around my and my downstairs neighbor's doors, and a bit wider if needed. Some of…

Well, I'm actually fascinated and wish to hear more. How did you figure out that the cops were funneling people?

He probably sees police trucks show up and unceremoniously dump homeless people and their belongings on their street.

Re: Clean Streets: People taking San Francisco’s trash into their own hands

#113

Post by [deleted] »

m0llusk wrote: post #109
nbardy wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hes not asking that “every imaginable need be fully covered”. He’s asking for the well funded sanitation department to do their job.

And yet that is completely unrealistic. The City currently funds weekly teams clearing out all the most troubled areas and that costs a fantastic amount up front as well as competing for increasingly precious landfill space. Defining the job of public works to be picking up all the trash that veritable armies of homeless generate does not make that job possible. You are absolutely and undeniably using your imaginatio…

[deleted]

Re: Clean Streets: People taking San Francisco’s trash into their own hands

#114

Post by jatone »

macinjosh wrote: post #3
ikt wrote: post #2

why does the local council not employ people to clean the streets?

They do. The government is just ineffective at its job.

you know what other group of humans are ineffective at their jobs?

every... single... one... corporations/government doesn't fucking matter. group of humans working together? inherently inefficient.

Re: Clean Streets: People taking San Francisco’s trash into their own hands

#115

Post by mbrodersen »

_dain_ wrote: post #48
nkrisc wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but it also sends the message that shooting up heroin is tolerated, even encouraged So what? An addict is going to shoot up whether it’s tolerated or not, and non-addicts aren’t going to take up heroin because they say a billboard. If you really want to end it, it’s going to need to be a lot more comprehensive, expensive, and expansive than the presence or absence of a billboard.

okay, how about we put up billboards saying >When you smash a window to rob a store, be careful not to cut yourself on the glass. Wear thick gloves. after all, a billboard is not going to stop a burglar, is it? and if we're going to have burglaries, it's better that the burglars don't injure themselves while committing their crimes, because after all it will reduce the burden on hospitals. it will also protect the st…

The heavily funded “Just Say No” campaign never worked. So what makes you think a billboard will somehow be more powerful than that?

Re: Clean Streets: People taking San Francisco’s trash into their own hands

#117

Post by spoonjim »

m0llusk wrote: post #109
nbardy wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hes not asking that “every imaginable need be fully covered”. He’s asking for the well funded sanitation department to do their job.

And yet that is completely unrealistic. The City currently funds weekly teams clearing out all the most troubled areas and that costs a fantastic amount up front as well as competing for increasingly precious landfill space. Defining the job of public works to be picking up all the trash that veritable armies of homeless generate does not make that job possible. You are absolutely and undeniably using your imaginatio…

Well the “armies of homeless” are also a public policy failure. If the homeless policy across the 50 largest American cities was identical, there would not be so many homeless in SF.

Re: Clean Streets: People taking San Francisco’s trash into their own hands

#118

Post by wolverine876 »

shlurpy wrote: post #95
wolverine876 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can't think of a community problem where a market-based solution even helped, let alone solved the problem. While I agree that the market isn't the panacea and God it's portrayed to be, I didn't understand the GP that way. Your point goes much too far the other way. Most of most community problems are solved by 'free' markets, including food (most food is bought and sold in the market), much of transportation (ca…

Food and shelter clearly aren't solved by the free market, or malnutrition and homelessness wouldn't be so prevelant. It just moves the problem to someone or somewhere else, and has to be augmented by public funds to keep the problems from exploding. And transportation isn't even close to a free market... when is the last time you traveled somewhere entirely on private unsubsidized infrastructure? You can't even leav…

> Food and shelter clearly aren't solved by the free market ...

That's shifting the goalposts and not what I said. They are mostly solved (along with other issues) by free markets. Most people get their food and shelter that way, and the market generates most of the wealth needed to feed and shelter the others.

Re: Clean Streets: People taking San Francisco’s trash into their own hands

#119

Post by joshribakoff »

computerphage wrote: post #103
_jal wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to clean up near my front door, but it became overwhelming. I live in a "bad" part of SF, by choice - I have a huge, cheap apartment. Until about 5 or so years ago, the homeless situation was not that bad around me. There would be periods where people with problems would be around, but generally it wasn't a big deal. I'd clean up around my and my downstairs neighbor's doors, and a bit wider if needed. Some of…

Well, I'm actually fascinated and wish to hear more. How did you figure out that the cops were funneling people?

He probably lives in the Tenderloin. It’s right next to union square which is full of hotels and tourists, and adjacent to Market Street which is all upscale shops, offices, and hotels that are heavily policed. The Tenderloin is known for having a larger population of drug dealers and people experiencing homelessness than many other parts of the city. I don’t think I’ve ever seen cops dump people off in trucks as the other commenter suggested, but I would characterize it as being policed differently

Re: Clean Streets: People taking San Francisco’s trash into their own hands

#120

Post by 1123581321 »

_dain_ wrote: post #33
yeetman21 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would allowing nature to take its course and having them die really be that bad? It is better for society for them to not exist (in a peaceful manner ie not outright jailing/ worse) or for them to exist and harass innocent bystanders? Think about it this way, if they did not exist, and you had the power to create them, would would willingly/ purposefully create them? They are taking up resource that could be better s…

I'm the GP poster but I don't agree with this social darwinist crap at all. I bet you would never apply this logic if your own kids fell into drug addiction. it is not "nature" taking its course here, it is a sick, stupid society that tolerates the proliferation of mind-altering poisons and then shovels vast amounts of public money into useless fake "rehab" charities run by politically-connected grifters. there are p…

That gets at the heart of the issue, which is our weak social and familiar bonds. Addiction remains prevalent because so few individuals or social groups have the courage and standing to significantly intervene. A parent would hopefully neither let their child die nor abandon them to an enabling harm reduction program. But most adults do not have anyone who loves them enough to take them to a safe place—likely at some expense—for two weeks to help with withdrawal. It’s heartbreaking.
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