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Why Are Topre Keyboards So Expensive?

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Re: Why Are Topre Keyboards So Expensive?

#361

Post by iCarrot »

mumblemumble wrote: post #283
LAC-Tech wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get the impression that mechanical keyboard people tend to be hard typers. The keyboard I have now uses cherry MX reds, and everything online suggested that these were super sensitive and you'd mis-type a lot. Only good for games. But honestly, I could go for something even easier to press. I fail to actuate the left shift with my small finger quite a lot. Guess I have a light touch.

It depends? Cherry MX keys have very stiff springs IMO - it's definitely an oldschool feel. Low profile keys tend to have a shorter pre-travel, and may have lower actuation force. They aren't available on a lot of keyboards, but I'm fond of Kailh Speed Copper switches. The travel and speed needed to activate the key is comparable to that of a mid-2000s Apple keyboard, but the tactile bump is much lighter, and there's…

>That said, the annoying thing here is that it's expensive to try keys

You can get switch tester kits off Aliexpress, I see there are $15-ish options that let you test 16-30 types of switches.

Re: Why Are Topre Keyboards So Expensive?

#362

Post by someuname »

bayindirh wrote: post #75
InternetPerson wrote: post #67

For me, one nice thing about working from home all the time now is that I don't have to listen to everyone's annoyingly loud mechanical keyboards. I kinda hope this fad dies before I have to work in an office again...

We have a bunch of old Sun Microsystems mechanical keyboards at the office, and they're not loud. I use a Cherry MX Brown equipped keyboard and it's not loud either. Does everyone use "Blue" switches over there? BTW, I don't believe mechanical keyboards are a fad. They're much better than the better rubber dome keyboards. Especially as they age.

>Cherry MX Brown

Significantly louder than a standard Dell membrane keyboard, or Logitech MX Keys, or Apple.

Re: Why Are Topre Keyboards So Expensive?

#363

Post by Aeolun »

rozab wrote: post #79
gh02t wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IBM keyboards were also astronomically expensive, the Model M was around $250 in 1985 which is something like $600 in 2021 dollars. The modern Unicomp incarnations made on the same tooling are not as nice as the OG Model M's, but they're a reasonable approximation and still only $100. I have no doubt the pricing on the HHKB and other Topre boards provides a very comfortable profit margin. Which is fine, if people are…

Wow, I had no idea the Model M was so pricey. I always assumed it was a big standard accessory that became a cult classic

I had so many of the things just lying around for so long. I got rid of more of those keyboards than I ever used.

Today I bought a 30 year old model M for $150 :/

I guess it’s still a good deal, but I feel kind of stupid now.

Re: Why Are Topre Keyboards So Expensive?

#364

Post by malnourish »

TacticalCoder wrote: post #223
nicopappl wrote: post #49

I have the privilege of owning a Happy Hacking 2, it has topre keys. I used it for about a year. And I hated it! It's insanely noisy, to the point of distraction. It's so damn loud. But the dealbreaker for me is how heavy and deep the keys are. It's just too much energy and travel time for efficient typing IMO. After long sessions my fingertips felt sore from the blunt damage of pushing down the keys. But I'll recogn…

I've got a totally different experience... I own three HHKB: two HHKB Pro JP (for they have a narrower spacebar and more modifiers: so less thumb travel: I do have very close Japanese family but I don't speak Japanese) and one HHKB Pro 2 (the first I got). They are, to me, out of this world. They ruined me forever in that I'll never be able to use something else than a Topre. I've got lots of IBM Model Ms, several Ch…

I'm typing this comment on a Leopold Topre keyboard. It is far and away my favorite keyboard. I like it more than my Moonlander or any other mechanical keyboard I've ever owned.

Re: Why Are Topre Keyboards So Expensive?

#365

Post by Aeolun »

intrasight wrote: post #224

I have purchased and tried many of the high-end keyboards over the years. I always switch back to my IBM Model M made in 1985. I have a couple of spares for parts. Every few years, I take it apart and put it in the dishwasher. update: I just flipped it over and see that the particular Model M I'm typing on is from 1991.

You’d think someone would make exact duplicates, but I haven’t found any of those.

Re: Why Are Topre Keyboards So Expensive?

#366

Post by iCarrot »

bsdubernerd wrote: post #345
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked at a company that gave people generous leeway to purchase computer gear they wanted. We already had good computers and monitors, so fancy mechanical keyboards were the #1 purchase for most people. The mechanical keyboard fans nerded out over different switches and other hardware, spending countless hours doing research and trying out different types of keys. And then slowly nearly everyone went back to regul…

As other posters mentioned, the recent "mechanical keyboard" subculture is all about show and boasting. It's not a surprise it seem to have boomed with gaming rigs and streaming channels. The keyboard in these circles is all about status, not function. If anything, I would compare it to "dubious" car mods like "cambered wheels". Due to RSI I tried dozens of keyboards over the years. When I see these new keyboards bei…

>Due to RSI I tried dozens of keyboards over the years. When I see these new keyboards being sold at these prices, especially the mechanical ones marketed with "improved layouts" and ergonomics, I have to laugh.

If you haven't got to the opensource crowd of the mechanical keyboard world yet, you should. Ergonomic is one of the problems that people are trying to solve, and their solutions are opensource.

Re: Why Are Topre Keyboards So Expensive?

#367

Post by bjoli »

bastijn wrote: post #336
bjoli wrote: post #331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have been through the whole mechanical keyboard phase and concluded that there are two keyboards I will never give up. Matias quiet click (mini) and my old trusty dome with slider of some brand I dont know (although googling around I suspect it is BTC). The matias has the nice tactility of a snappy rubber dome with the benefit of not having to bottom out. I DO bottom out, but I am such a light typer that I sometime…

Silent switches saw quite an uptake since past two years or so. Never had matias quiet click myself but based on YouTube vids I'd say you can go a whole lot quieter without losing tactility these days. I run an office setup with U4S these days, these are good to go out of the box if you don't like to mod them. They are so silent your coworkers keyboards will sound loud in comparison. Their tactility is still awesome.…

The matias quiet click arent really meant to be very silent. I think it alludes to the tactility of their clicky switch minus the click. Their quiet linears are dampened light linear switches, and sound less than most rubber domes.

Matias boards are just no-nonsense boards for typists. I dont like fiddling with my keyboard. No keycaps. No lubing. No swapping switches. I have done that. It is a distraction for me. I like typing on my matias board. When that dies I will get another one or maybe just use my old no-brand dome-with-slider keyboard (probably BTC) that I have used since 1994.

Re: Why Are Topre Keyboards So Expensive?

#368

Post by enaaem »

csdvrx wrote: post #147
Lio wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have an IBM model M and a Pkr3 with Cherry MX Browns sitting on the shelf. What I’ve discovered over time is that I’m some kind of peasant when it comes to typing. What I really like are thin, low travel laptop keyboards and trackpads instead of mice. Small, symmetrical with everything centred below an external monitor. I love the idea of mechanical keyboards but the reality is that actuation force and the key trav…

> What I’ve discovered over time is that I’m some kind of peasant when it comes to typing. You and me both. I love low travel keyboard that make little noise. I've learned to accept my personal tastes, even if they don't match what's expected of me. BTW I wonder how much of a learned preference mechanical keyboards are? At first, I thought they were preferred by older geeks because of a nostalgia factors, but they al…

I wonder how much of the mechanical keyboard popularity is just gaming marketing? I also prefer lower key travel and quieter keys. It is just lest straining.

Take for example expensive gaming chairs that look like race car chairs. The side support makes no sense since gamers do not experience high g-forces. The side support lowers mobility which is actually really bad for your back.

Re: Why Are Topre Keyboards So Expensive?

#369

Post by bsdubernerd »

iCarrot wrote: post #366
bsdubernerd wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As other posters mentioned, the recent "mechanical keyboard" subculture is all about show and boasting. It's not a surprise it seem to have boomed with gaming rigs and streaming channels. The keyboard in these circles is all about status, not function. If anything, I would compare it to "dubious" car mods like "cambered wheels". Due to RSI I tried dozens of keyboards over the years. When I see these new keyboards bei…

>Due to RSI I tried dozens of keyboards over the years. When I see these new keyboards being sold at these prices, especially the mechanical ones marketed with "improved layouts" and ergonomics, I have to laugh. If you haven't got to the opensource crowd of the mechanical keyboard world yet, you should. Ergonomic is one of the problems that people are trying to solve, and their solutions are opensource.

Oh I'm fully aware. This scene has been going on far longer than the current wave of mechanical keyboard craze (and it often doesn't emphasize switches as much either). I consider the two groups completely distinct.

Re: Why Are Topre Keyboards So Expensive?

#370

Post by neurotrace »

xwdv wrote: post #248
twhb wrote: post #161

The mechanical keyboard community is unfortunately really toxic. In addition to second hand accounts, I have a friend who’s a newbie in it who I encouraged to talk to people to get her bearings, and there was a basically unanimous chorus of “fuck off, until you have something to offer us you’re just a waste of time”. I think it’s partially because it’s largely gamers, and partially because it’s largely about perceive…

It seems toxic because we all started from nothing and learned things ourselves without having to make asinine posts asking the same questions over and over. The answers you seek are out there. Newbies are great until they start talking and pollute forums with low value discussions, and increasingly it seems even newbs never want to talk with other newbs, for these reasons.

Found the toxic person. RTFM isn't really the best look and I love answering noob questions even if I've seen them a number of times.
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