Amazon to stop accepting UK Visa credit cards • Hacker News Board

Re: Amazon to stop accepting UK Visa credit cards

#111

Post by toyg » Wed, Nov 17, 2021, 10:38 AM UTC

gambiting wrote: post #85

mrec wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> most people buying stuff on Amazon would be using a debit card, folks only really use credit cards for large purchases Huh? I'm in the UK, have been an Amazon customer for over 20 years and have always used a credit card for everything. I didn't even know you could use a debit card, and can't see any reason you'd want to. Paid off in full every month, better consumer protection, what's not to like?

You must be an actual anomaly, like yeah, what you are saying makes sense, but you are the only person I've ever heard about who does that here in UK. Everyone I know, me included, just uses debit cards for purchases everywhere including Amazon. I have a credit card but I very very very rarely use it for anything.

Uk here, I use credit cards for everything. Used wisely, consumer credit is incredibly useful. Example: bought a 4k motorbike, dealer finance or savings drawdown would have cost me hundreds; slapped it all on an 18-months 0% card and am now slowly repaying it on my own schedule, at no extra cost, while happily riding the thing.

Re: Amazon to stop accepting UK Visa credit cards

#112

Post by ericyan » Wed, Nov 17, 2021, 10:39 AM UTC

gambiting wrote: post #89

ericyan wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This practise is illegal in the UK and that's probably why they decided to this instead

It's illegal everywhere in the EU as well. If a merchant accepts debit/credit cards then they are not allowed to charge extra for using them.

Yeah, the catch is "if a merchant accepts..."

I live in the Netherlands and biggest supermarket chain here, Albert Heijn, is strictly Mastro-only. This is not a problem for the locals, but you will find angry reviews left by tourists on pretty much every ah branch in Amsterdam on Google Maps.

Re: Amazon to stop accepting UK Visa credit cards

#113

Post by gambiting » Wed, Nov 17, 2021, 10:39 AM UTC

toyg wrote: post #111

gambiting wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You must be an actual anomaly, like yeah, what you are saying makes sense, but you are the only person I've ever heard about who does that here in UK. Everyone I know, me included, just uses debit cards for purchases everywhere including Amazon. I have a credit card but I very very very rarely use it for anything.

Uk here, I use credit cards for everything. Used wisely, consumer credit is incredibly useful. Example: bought a 4k motorbike, dealer finance or savings drawdown would have cost me hundreds; slapped it all on an 18-months 0% card and am now slowly repaying it on my own schedule, at no extra cost, while happily riding the thing.

Yeah of course, I do the same thing - when I said I use mine "very rarely" I meant that I use it for things like buying laptops or other expensive things, to use the 0% interest period. I just don't know anyone who actually uses it for day to day purchases from amazon and such, I just use my debit card for that.

Re: Amazon to stop accepting UK Visa credit cards

#114

Post by ovi256 » Wed, Nov 17, 2021, 10:39 AM UTC

mrec wrote: post #43

em10fan wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quite the opposite in the UK, at least over the last 10 years or so. 99% of debit cards are Visa, and most people buying stuff on Amazon would be using a debit card, folks only really use credit cards for large purchases and things like travel, here. Even when it comes to credit cards, I would say Mastercard has like a large chunk - like 80% in terms of institutions (but who knows in terms of actual customers), I wou…

> most people buying stuff on Amazon would be using a debit card, folks only really use credit cards for large purchases Huh? I'm in the UK, have been an Amazon customer for over 20 years and have always used a credit card for everything. I didn't even know you could use a debit card, and can't see any reason you'd want to. Paid off in full every month, better consumer protection, what's not to like?

The fact that you, one individual uses CCs for everything does not contradict the facts that he gave.

Re: Amazon to stop accepting UK Visa credit cards

#115

Post by iampims » Wed, Nov 17, 2021, 10:40 AM UTC

ericd wrote: post #104

jdiez17 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what's not to like? Well, the predatory business model, for one. The reason your credit card company can offer you "better consumer protection" and other benefits is because they count on a percentage of people not paying off their debt in time (and thus making more money out of them). Also, I personally wouldn't want "better consumer protection" to be mediated by a private company. That should just be the default.

It's not necessarily predatory, so much as they take a couple percent of everything that flows through them. Also, they don't take the hit on chargebacks, the merchant does. Those two things cover purchase protection just fine without relying on people getting hit with high interest rates.

And merchant add 2% to their base price which amounts to everyone not using a credit card “subsidizing” the benefits to all credit card users.

Re: Amazon to stop accepting UK Visa credit cards

#116

Post by gambiting » Wed, Nov 17, 2021, 10:40 AM UTC

ericyan wrote: post #112

gambiting wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's illegal everywhere in the EU as well. If a merchant accepts debit/credit cards then they are not allowed to charge extra for using them.

Yeah, the catch is "if a merchant accepts..." I live in the Netherlands and biggest supermarket chain here, Albert Heijn, is strictly Mastro-only. This is not a problem for the locals, but you will find angry reviews left by tourists on pretty much every ah branch in Amsterdam on Google Maps.

Sure, and in theory that should be the prime example of "free market" at work - merchant doesn't want to accept visa/mastercard? They will lose customers then, if that's acceptable to them then that's their choice.

Re: Amazon to stop accepting UK Visa credit cards

#117

Post by qalmakka » Wed, Nov 17, 2021, 10:43 AM UTC

VAT evasion is widespread in certain countries (like Italy for instance), and pushing people to prefer electronic payments to cash is empirically the only realistic way to counter it, but there will always be resistance from small retailers until payment fees are low enough. The availability of electronic payments should be universal, I personally hate being forced to constantly carry cash on myself at all times.

In a cashless society, there's no point in mugging and robbing, because people don't have untraceable items of value on the at all times.

Re: Amazon to stop accepting UK Visa credit cards

#118

Post by toyg » Wed, Nov 17, 2021, 10:44 AM UTC

ZeroGravitas wrote: post #5

Has anyone successfully nationalised/regulated into sanity this business? It's 2021, buying stuff should involve neither precious metals nor weird faceless financial cooperatives owned by private banks.

Buying is effectively a solved problem, the circuits will be de-facto nationalised across Europe very soon if they're not already, as an inevitable outcome of going cashless (which COVID19 accelerated). What will likely never be nationalised is credit, that's where VISA/MSC/AMEX/MBNA will hang around for the foreseeable - unless some of the "new banks" like Revolut and Starling explode on a level where they can afford to start their own thing.

Re: Amazon to stop accepting UK Visa credit cards

#119

Post by toyg » Wed, Nov 17, 2021, 10:45 AM UTC

blowfish721 wrote: post #108

rightbyte wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? Nice. There is no need to have Visa et al. take a 1-3% tax on everything.

Downside of this as a tourist/visitor in Denmark at least some smaller shops force you to pay with cash since they don’t accept visa/mastercard but only the national debit card. Just a minor annoyance at least as a Swede since we don’t usually carry cash these days.

I reckon a situation like that is un-European, the Commission will probably step in at some point.

Re: Amazon to stop accepting UK Visa credit cards

#120

Post by Blackstone4 » Wed, Nov 17, 2021, 10:46 AM UTC

input_sh wrote: post #79

mrec wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> most people buying stuff on Amazon would be using a debit card, folks only really use credit cards for large purchases Huh? I'm in the UK, have been an Amazon customer for over 20 years and have always used a credit card for everything. I didn't even know you could use a debit card, and can't see any reason you'd want to. Paid off in full every month, better consumer protection, what's not to like?

Here's why: two debit cards, one for receiving money, one for spending money. Automated payment from the 1st one to the 2nd one once a month with a fixed amount you expect to spend in a month. Nothing to pay off, you're spending your own money, can't be overcharged, can't go below zero, if someone leaks your spending card they can't touch the majority of your money, no scummy business practices. Never owned a credit…

Don't most people do this with a credit card they pay off most months? This is what I do plus credit cards give more protection than debit cards.

I have the majority of my net worth invested at one of my brokers and I tend to hold minimal cash in my bank account...better to be invested than hold cash these days.