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Divorce does funny things

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Re: Divorce does funny things

#61

Post by Justin308 »

cryptonector wrote: post #48
me_im_counting wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are they? At least among wealthy men, it seems much more common for them to remarry and make a brand new second family while the ex wife is left doing most things for the first set of kids. Plus, it’s significantly more common for men to leave their wives when their wives get diagnosed with cancer than vice versa. IMO, divorce sucks worst for whoever is the most conscientious person and invested in the family, regard…

Are wealthy men the majority of divorced men? You seem to be assuming as much.

Fathers are granted custody only 18.3% of the timey.

Mothers are awarded child support nearly 2 times as often as fathers are

Fathers are awarded nearly 10% less, on average, in child support

Fathers receive less of the awarded child support than mothers

More than 25% of fathers live apart from their children

Re: Divorce does funny things

#62

Post by bananamerica »

cm2012 wrote: post #58

On infidelity - to some extent people's personal business is not my business. But if I hear that someone was unfaithful to their spouse, my business trust in them goes waaay down. If they're willing to break trust with the person closest to them in their life, what chance do I have as a mere business partner of not being screwed over at some point?

People cheat for many reasons. Some of these reasons are only applicable to personal relationships. So yeah, a cheater can be a good business partner.

Re: Divorce does funny things

#63

Post by me_im_counting »

tasogare wrote: post #55
cryptonector wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are wealthy men the majority of divorced men? You seem to be assuming as much.

Not only this but the cancer related statistics is oddly specific, and chose only because it put men in a bad light. Without numbers (count and percentage) caused by this plus the ventilation by sex it's totally meaningless: the affirmation could be true with only three divorces a year where two men leave and one woman does. On the reverse, men being taken half of their wealth plus having a pension to pay is the over…

I actually am quite sympathetic to challenges facing men, and agree that many don’t seem to care. For example, the utter lack of sympathy for male victims of marital infidelity is mind blowing to me. Women tend to be supported when their husband cheats on them, and men tend to be blamed and viewed as responsible when their wife cheats. I was simply pointing out observations counter to the assertion that men categorically have it worse in divorce, and did not come to a conclusion in either direction. There is too much gender based vitriol in general in these situations. The truth is there are sociopathic, selfish, narcissistic, etc people of both genders and ultimately that callous quality is the salient one in the cases I’ve seen, not gender.

Re: Divorce does funny things

#64

Post by 88840-8855 »

cm2012 wrote: post #58

On infidelity - to some extent people's personal business is not my business. But if I hear that someone was unfaithful to their spouse, my business trust in them goes waaay down. If they're willing to break trust with the person closest to them in their life, what chance do I have as a mere business partner of not being screwed over at some point?

i think that's a little naive. cheating is a highly emotional thing. business relationships are a rational thing.

although some people are mixing both up, most of people i have worked with manage to separate.

one of my moost loyal colleagues is cheating on his wife for years. and yet, he is loyal to the tasks and to the company.

hence, i find your view a little naive and funny and perhaps would label it with some -ism if there was some -ism term for what you think. making conclusions on people based on a thing that is 100% private and not related to the professional life is an -ism.

Re: Divorce does funny things

#65

Post by pjerem »

Johnny555 wrote: post #53
mrsmee89 wrote: post #9

As a divorced man, I can attest to this wholeheartedly. There's an energy a man gets when you're building a family that helps motivate through the struggle. When you get divorced, especially when kids are involved, there's an expectation in our society (court system, social pressure, etc) to continue life as if that energy still exists, it simply doesn't. It's maddening. Breaking up a family is lose-lose. There are n…

Divorce is considerably easier for a childless couple. At least as long as the couple manages to be reasonably civil to each other. That doesn't make it "easy", but it is "easier" to not have a bond keeping you attached to the former spouse forever. My ex and I managed to share joint custody of our dog for years, until she moved away and we decided she should keep the dog. Much harder to do that with a child.

> Much harder

Impossible *

Re: Divorce does funny things

#66

Post by lelanthran »

s5300 wrote: post #50
lelanthran wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Anecdata: the males I've personally seem "opting out" have major personal issues and are honestly dangerous to any potential partners, mentally and physically. Doesn't matter, if too many males opt out females would either have to be alone or compete for the remaining males. Competition would certainly result in changes in male behaviour (because they won't be competing for a mate). This is a vicious cycle which wo…

>if too many males opt out females would either have to be alone or compete for the remaining males. I don't know what's shaped your worldview, but this really isn't how things work, at all. >This is a vicious cycle which would result in more males having "major personal issues". Oh well. With the current trajectory of tech, we'll soon be able to identify these types from whatever tech they use and send out a robo-ta…

> I don't know what's shaped your worldview, but this really isn't how things work, at all.

Okay, what do you think happens when there is an imbalance in the ratio of male:female?

Re: Divorce does funny things

#67

Post by Justin308 »

Johnny555 wrote: post #53
mrsmee89 wrote: post #9

As a divorced man, I can attest to this wholeheartedly. There's an energy a man gets when you're building a family that helps motivate through the struggle. When you get divorced, especially when kids are involved, there's an expectation in our society (court system, social pressure, etc) to continue life as if that energy still exists, it simply doesn't. It's maddening. Breaking up a family is lose-lose. There are n…

Divorce is considerably easier for a childless couple. At least as long as the couple manages to be reasonably civil to each other. That doesn't make it "easy", but it is "easier" to not have a bond keeping you attached to the former spouse forever. My ex and I managed to share joint custody of our dog for years, until she moved away and we decided she should keep the dog. Much harder to do that with a child.

I went through this but with a child in the US. My ex wife decided to move away 3,000 miles away with our child. I spent a year fighting in court and spend $150k+ in lawyers fees. Being a man with a child under 6 y/o, you have almost no chance to block a mom to move away with the kid across the country. Most men think it won't happen to them, until their wife decides that "she's not happy". Even though the workforce is changing, the family law is still stuck in the 1960's, considering the dad as the breadwinner and the mom as the caregiver. Watch the movie marriage story.

Re: Divorce does funny things

#68

Post by jessriedel »

me_im_counting wrote: post #27
mrsmee89 wrote: post #9

As a divorced man, I can attest to this wholeheartedly. There's an energy a man gets when you're building a family that helps motivate through the struggle. When you get divorced, especially when kids are involved, there's an expectation in our society (court system, social pressure, etc) to continue life as if that energy still exists, it simply doesn't. It's maddening. Breaking up a family is lose-lose. There are n…

Are they? At least among wealthy men, it seems much more common for them to remarry and make a brand new second family while the ex wife is left doing most things for the first set of kids. Plus, it’s significantly more common for men to leave their wives when their wives get diagnosed with cancer than vice versa. IMO, divorce sucks worst for whoever is the most conscientious person and invested in the family, regard…

Fwiw, the large majority (~70%) of divorces are initiated by women in the US. Most divorces are not caused by cancer, and the advantage men have in re-marrying later are known and appreciated. So I think we can take the fact that most divorces are initiated by women as prima facie evidence that women recover better from divorces.

Re: Divorce does funny things

#69

Post by krisrm »

cm2012 wrote: post #58

On infidelity - to some extent people's personal business is not my business. But if I hear that someone was unfaithful to their spouse, my business trust in them goes waaay down. If they're willing to break trust with the person closest to them in their life, what chance do I have as a mere business partner of not being screwed over at some point?

Agreed. It certainly doesn't demonstrate honesty or integrity, qualities which I value. While I'm sure plenty of adulterous people have made fine business partners... I'll take mine without, thanks.

Re: Divorce does funny things

#70

Post by romeros »

cm2012 wrote: post #58

On infidelity - to some extent people's personal business is not my business. But if I hear that someone was unfaithful to their spouse, my business trust in them goes waaay down. If they're willing to break trust with the person closest to them in their life, what chance do I have as a mere business partner of not being screwed over at some point?

It's only that black and white to you because of your naivety and a lack of understanding of how the world really works.

The solution for this as for many other things is to switch off the computer and actually go out and experience the world and become more worldly. Otherwise, you will end up building a mental model of reality that quite doesn't exist.

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