Here’s the actual article, since the people that write these press releases somehow think that the actual paper is unimportant:
Study finds a difference between neurons of humans and other mammals
31–40 of 82 posts
Re: Study finds a difference between neurons of humans and other mammals
#32I wonder how are the ion channels of Dolphins are like.
Re: Study finds a difference between neurons of humans and other mammals
#33>They were able to obtain brain tissue from 10 mammalian species: Etruscan shrews (one of the smallest known mammals), gerbils, mice, rats, Guinea pigs, ferrets, rabbits, marmosets, and macaques, as well as human tissue removed from patients with epilepsy during brain surgery. Offbeat question: Could it be that epilepsy is a disorder caused by this missing ion channel, and this isn't true for all humans?
I wondered the same thing.
Re: Study finds a difference between neurons of humans and other mammals
#34I highly doubt that reducing the number of channels is a simple efficiency hack, if it was simple to just reduce the density then animals would have had lower density just like humans. The question to ask is why humans would benefit from having fewer channels while animals doesn't. My naïve hunch tells me that this could be related to rationality in some way, that weakening the ion pump signals could make it easier f…
> My naïve hunch tells me that this could be related to rationality in some way, that weakening the ion pump signals could make it easier for cells to learn and make alternate computations, creating humans strong rationality that is capable of overriding our natural urges. That's quite a conclusion you're jumping to... "rationality" is a word denoting a very complex concept obtaining its meaning only through a specif…
> That's quite a conclusion you're jumping to...
It isn't a conclusion, it is a hypothesis. Human rationality is what makes us unique among animals, so anything that sets our brain apart from animals could be related to it and therefore warrants further study to see if it is relevant to human intelligence.
> "rationality" is a word denoting a very complex concept obtaining its meaning only through a specific historic background including a lot of assumptions that are not as universal as you might think.
> I would always be very careful when trying to bridge between
In what way am I not careful here? It would be great if we could make a connection so we should explore any potential connection further, why are you against that?
Is your point that this is a hard problem to solve and therefore we shouldn't look for solutions? The link I posited here is very far out, yes, but it is still possible that there is a link and if there actually is one it would be a huge discovery.
Re: Study finds a difference between neurons of humans and other mammals
#35Earlier quoted context omitted.
Quite, but I don't think GP is jumping to a conclusion. More like proposing an interesting hypothesis.
To say it less politely: To me it seems more like stoner talk. "Quantum entanglement, ... blablabla, ... collective subconscious, ... blablabla, ... everything is connected, man!"
I don't think you understand how science works. The aim isn't to be correct, the aim is to find potential areas of progress. Is my hypothesis here most likely incorrect? Yes, of course it is, but that doesn't matter since if it is correct it would be huge and therefore it is worth exploring.
But thanks for your comment, now I understand better how luddites thinks. So in the future when I make comments like above I'll say "this hypothesis is unlikely to be true but...", so that even luddites can understand it.
Re: Study finds a difference between neurons of humans and other mammals
#36I highly doubt that reducing the number of channels is a simple efficiency hack, if it was simple to just reduce the density then animals would have had lower density just like humans. The question to ask is why humans would benefit from having fewer channels while animals doesn't. My naïve hunch tells me that this could be related to rationality in some way, that weakening the ion pump signals could make it easier f…
> My naïve hunch tells me that this could be related to rationality in some way, that weakening the ion pump signals could make it easier for cells to learn and make alternate computations, creating humans strong rationality that is capable of overriding our natural urges. That's quite a conclusion you're jumping to... "rationality" is a word denoting a very complex concept obtaining its meaning only through a specif…
The poster could have meant "maybe a reduction in the density of ion channels does much more than change the mechanism: it also forces the function to adapt in different directions (say, towards the basis for more distinctive abilities)".
Re: Study finds a difference between neurons of humans and other mammals
#37Earlier quoted context omitted.
> My naïve hunch tells me that this could be related to rationality in some way, that weakening the ion pump signals could make it easier for cells to learn and make alternate computations, creating humans strong rationality that is capable of overriding our natural urges. That's quite a conclusion you're jumping to... "rationality" is a word denoting a very complex concept obtaining its meaning only through a specif…
> That's quite a conclusion you're jumping to... It isn't a conclusion, it is a hypothesis. Human rationality is what makes us unique among animals, so anything that sets our brain apart from animals could be related to it and therefore warrants further study to see if it is relevant to human intelligence. > "rationality" is a word denoting a very complex concept obtaining its meaning only through a specific historic…
> Human rationality is what makes us unique among animals
Are you sure? It seems to us that reasoning, to some degree, is a distributed gift - in fact, all brains are there to take decisions.
See for example https://www.uh.edu/news-events/stories/2017/november/1101201...
Re: Study finds a difference between neurons of humans and other mammals
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
> That's quite a conclusion you're jumping to... It isn't a conclusion, it is a hypothesis. Human rationality is what makes us unique among animals, so anything that sets our brain apart from animals could be related to it and therefore warrants further study to see if it is relevant to human intelligence. > "rationality" is a word denoting a very complex concept obtaining its meaning only through a specific historic…
> Human rationality is what makes us unique among animals Are you sure? It seems to us that reasoning, to some degree, is a distributed gift - in fact, all brains are there to take decisions . See for example https://www.uh.edu/news-events/stories/2017/november/1101201...
The levels to which humans can learn rationality is in a completely different league from animals, so yes I'll say I'm pretty sure about that. It is like the difference between merge sort and bogo sort, sure they solve the same problem but bogo sorting doesn't work for anything but datasets with a few elements. Animals reasoning chains breaks down extremely quickly, they can do a few steps, but humans can do hundreds or thousands of steps and the reasoning can still be solid and useful even after that many steps.
Re: Study finds a difference between neurons of humans and other mammals
#39Earlier quoted context omitted.
To say it less politely: To me it seems more like stoner talk. "Quantum entanglement, ... blablabla, ... collective subconscious, ... blablabla, ... everything is connected, man!"
I don't think you understand how science works. The aim isn't to be correct, the aim is to find potential areas of progress. Is my hypothesis here most likely incorrect? Yes, of course it is, but that doesn't matter since if it is correct it would be huge and therefore it is worth exploring. But thanks for your comment, now I understand better how luddites thinks. So in the future when I make comments like above I'll…
> I don't think you understand how science works
I have some understanding of how science works. The purpose remains to find plausible explanations to phenomena, explanations that show some solidity.
The same value - linked to grounds - remains valid for statements in general. This is why we refine them, in the internal "lab", where they are tried under duress of criticism. Which is scientific process.
Re: Study finds a difference between neurons of humans and other mammals
#40Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Human rationality is what makes us unique among animals Are you sure? It seems to us that reasoning, to some degree, is a distributed gift - in fact, all brains are there to take decisions . See for example https://www.uh.edu/news-events/stories/2017/november/1101201...
The levels to which humans can learn rationality is in a completely different league from animals, so yes I'll say I'm pretty sure about that. It is like the difference between merge sort and bogo sort, sure they solve the same problem but bogo sorting doesn't work for anything but datasets with a few elements. Animals reasoning chains breaks down extremely quickly, they can do a few steps, but humans can do hundreds…
That is a quantitative difference, not a qualitative one. And it is probably related to a synergy of functions.