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The Framework Laptop Is Great for a Linux-Friendly, Upgradeable/Modular Laptop

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Re: The Framework Laptop Is Great for a Linux-Friendly, Upgradeable/Modular Laptop

#121

Post by jagger27 »

judge2020 wrote: post #34
thereddaikon wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will get easier right up until x86 MacOS is no longer updated and then will immediately become a thing of the past.

Monterey supports the 2013 Mac Pro and 2014 Mac Mini, so if we can expect only 8 years of actual OS support, we'll probably see 8 more years of OS updates for stuff like the 2020 Intel iMac and Intel Macbook Air & Pro. That's a long while before this becomes a possibility. https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT212551

As a particularly relevant counter example, the last PowerPC Macs were sold until August 2006. Mac OS X Leopard came out a year later in October 2007 and received its last patch (10.5.8) in August 2009. That's a lot less than 8 years.

This is why when the first M1 Macs were announced I immediately sold my 16" i9 MacBook Pro and bought an M1 Air for much less than I sold the Intel machine for.

Re: The Framework Laptop Is Great for a Linux-Friendly, Upgradeable/Modular Laptop

#122

Post by aidenn0 »

mkaic wrote: post #119
aidenn0 wrote: post #109

The Framework Laptop is literally the first time ever I've seen a laptop and wished I was at the point in my upgrade-cycle to get a new laptop. Right now I have 2-3 more years of use out of my current laptop before I upgrade though.

On the bright side, that means that even cooler second or third gen Frameworks will be available when you do end up upgrading!

I really hope so. The alternative is they could go out of business (even with demand being good, supply-chain logistics is challenging right now)

Re: The Framework Laptop Is Great for a Linux-Friendly, Upgradeable/Modular Laptop

#123

Post by Hemospectrum »

kall wrote: post #7
jacknews wrote: post #3

I love the idea of modular, upgradable, and especially linux-friendly. But, because modular, I'd like a Framework Surface. Having the screen, keyboard, touchpad, computer, etc all integrated into a single device, seems like far too many factors and constraints to be able to reach perfection. Better to split at least the keyboard and pointing device, so you can pick and choose.

That would be very interesting. Maybe I could finally fulfill my dream of a portable system that can raise the display to eye level while keeping the keyboard at an ergonomic level. I‘m surprised no one else seems to want this. Imagine if you could clip your screen onto the headrest in front of you. Wouldn‘t that be a huge improvement?

For a few years now I’ve wished for this kind of thing. After I sketched out a couple of concepts, the approach that looked most viable was to build a folding keyboard case where the lid opens up into a tablet stand. This hugely reduces the scope of the design problem, because PCB mounting holes for mechanical 60% keyboards are more or less standardized, and tablets are obviously commodities. Even so, this is easier said than done. I didn’t (and still don’t) have enough experience designing things with hinges; I don’t know how to make things thin, light, easy to build, yet still strong enough to throw around; and I could never decide what to do about mice.

Re: The Framework Laptop Is Great for a Linux-Friendly, Upgradeable/Modular Laptop

#124

Post by DoingIsLearning »

mdp2021 wrote: post #4
kavalg wrote: post #2

Looks like this is the official site: https://frame.work/ "Framework Laptop starts at $999. DIY Edition configurable from $749." - that's for the base model. Unfortunately I didn't see the display specifications while configuring the product. That is a major factor when making a decision for me.

And one of the pictures from Larabel (third in first page, https://www.phoronix.net/image.php?id=framework-laptop&image... ) does not seem to show a matte display, though I am not sure... Edit: confirmed glossy on other reviews.

I asked this question to Nirav, one of the founders in a previous HN thread about the laptop.

He clarified that there is currently no matte option with no plans for display options.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27948272

Perhaps if they realise there is a market that direction can be changed? (One can hope)

Re: The Framework Laptop Is Great for a Linux-Friendly, Upgradeable/Modular Laptop

#125

Post by stormbrew »

_qbjt wrote: post #103

I'm typing this on my Framework now and I have to say it really is a special device. The prevailing culture of treating technology as disposable is something I personally don't vibe with - I always keep all of my tech and have collected machines over the years that most people would probably consider obsolete and uninteresting (there's an Amiga 1000 and iMac G3 currently in my field of view). Having a fully open mach…

> 4. The 3:2 display is awesome for programming and content creation, and I don't know why more devices don't adopt it. My only criticism is that it's not a touch screen but with how modular this laptop is it's only a matter of time before that becomes an option.

Really strongly agree with both points here as a new owner of a framework laptop. My old personal laptop had a 16:9 (not 16:10) screen and wow the difference is so stark in terms of usability for anything that benefits from vertical orientation. Suddenly I wish you could still get 4:3 desktop monitors again. I kinda filled that gap with rotatable 16x10 monitors but honestly I just kind of miss 4:3.

The 16x9 laptop is still nice for watching videos though.

Re: The Framework Laptop Is Great for a Linux-Friendly, Upgradeable/Modular Laptop

#126

Post by noahtallen »

fsflover wrote: post #75
0des wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for the reply, however, I cannot disable my personal values and preferences.

Could you tell us what are they based on? My ones are on security and control.

One example for me is Linux support in the GPU wars. Nvidia has been very hostile to Linux compared to AMD, so philosophically (for now), I’ll prefer AMD for my platform despite Nvidia offering a better GPU. Not as big a deal with Intel, but I like encouraging what I see as good behavior. AMD market share isn’t anywhere near Intel either, so I also like putting my money on the “underdog” to keep the competition going.

Re: The Framework Laptop Is Great for a Linux-Friendly, Upgradeable/Modular Laptop

#127

Post by Tuna-Fish »

bitwize wrote: post #105
xrd wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been researching this and the sellers of this assert they are selling licenses that are left over and entirely legitimate. It's a secondary market, not unlike used cars or anything else that is more tangible. I think there might be precedent for this to be legal even if Microsoft wouldn't like it be so.

It's illegal. Software is licensed, not sold; and software licenses are usually nontransferable. This was a point of contention in Vernor v. Autodesk wherein the 9th Circuit found for Autodesk.

In the United States, you are right. In the EU, that is wrong. See for example: [0]

The reason you can get entirely legal windows licenses for so cheap is that there are many institutional buyers who get the licenses they actually use separately but still purchase a lot of computers that have OEM licenses bundled [1], and now they all unload those licenses at whatever price the market will bear. Last year, that was ~6€, this year it's down to ~3€.

The fact that the prices is now so low is probably a part of why it keeps going down. A lot of people in this thread express suprise that a legit key could be so cheap so they obviously must be illegal, which drives away sales.

[0] https://www.computerworld.com/article/2505356/eu-court-rules...

[1] And do note that tying the OEM license to hardware is also entirely illegal inside the EU.

Re: The Framework Laptop Is Great for a Linux-Friendly, Upgradeable/Modular Laptop

#128

Post by Grimm665 »

_qbjt wrote: post #103

I'm typing this on my Framework now and I have to say it really is a special device. The prevailing culture of treating technology as disposable is something I personally don't vibe with - I always keep all of my tech and have collected machines over the years that most people would probably consider obsolete and uninteresting (there's an Amiga 1000 and iMac G3 currently in my field of view). Having a fully open mach…

For number 3, the bluetooth issue, I also encountered this on NixOS but it seems to have been fixed with kernel 5.15.0 I upgraded to this week. But maybe I've just been lucky :/

Re: The Framework Laptop Is Great for a Linux-Friendly, Upgradeable/Modular Laptop

#130

Post by slantyyz »

LNSY wrote: post #40

I'm left handed and track-pads have never agreed with me. Other people on this site have recommended the MNT Reform to me: https://www.crowdsupply.com/mnt/reform It seems like a different flavor of an open source laptop that people who want a better keyboard and has the option of a trackball (!!!) instead of the trackpad. I think the MNT is going to be my next laptop, but the Frame.work is pretty cool.

Oh wow, the MNT is surprisingly cool.

It reminds me of the Apple PowerBook 170 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PowerBook_170) I had in the early 90s.

I loved the trackball on those early PowerBooks.

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