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Launch HN: Dendron (YC W21) – Structured note-taking for developers and teams

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61–70 of 89 posts

Re: Launch HN: Dendron (YC W21) – Structured note-taking for developers and teams

#61

Only reason I don't use Dendron more is because I'm not a fan of VS Code. Just not for me I guess. Something I've been exploring is using Dendron on my desktop at work (with dual monitors) and Obsidian on my Chromebook. I convert the notes from both into a TiddlyWiki site and view/query them at the same time. Apologies for interrupting the casual dismissals.

What is TiddlyWiki good for?

Re: Launch HN: Dendron (YC W21) – Structured note-taking for developers and teams

#63

Has there been any investigation into getting Dendron working with https://vscode.dev ? That is, turning it into a web extension[0]? [0]: https://code.visualstudio.com/api/extension-guides/web-exten...

short answer - yes. we plan on enabling this, optimistically end of the year, or beginning of next year at the latest

Re: Launch HN: Dendron (YC W21) – Structured note-taking for developers and teams

#64

Congrats on the launch! I've been using Foam [1] for the last year, which is an open-source vscode-powered aternative to obsidian. There seems to be a large overlap in features. What benefits does Dendron have over Foam that would convince me to switch? [1] https://github.com/foambubble/foam/

You're right, there is overlap in the sense that both Dendron and Foam are open source note taking tools based around vscode and markdown. Dendron differs in our focus on structure - while we support backlinks, wikilinks, and tags, the primary way of navigating notes in Dendron is by hierarchy which can be described by schemas (our type system for note hierarchies). We provide extensive tooling around traversing and manipulating this structure (lookup, refactoring, etc)

For a more detailed breakdown, you can see the foam vs dendron page here -> https://wiki.dendron.so/notes/p5fMTi-6zOyX1TwhL6dM0.html

Re: Launch HN: Dendron (YC W21) – Structured note-taking for developers and teams

#65

So a quick glance makes it seem fairly similar to Obsidian... as the docs note, it's built on top of VS Code vs Obsidian which is standalone... What are some reasons Obsidian users would want to switch?

You're right - Dendron has a lot of similarities with Obsidian. A lot of our users come from people looking for open source obsidian alternatives. Our main differentiator is our focus on structure - we let users create their own taxonomies using "Dendron schemas" which they can use to both document and change their note hierarchies over time. A big focus in Dendron: how do you continue working with your knowledge bas…

i know why it's not this way, and love what you've built, but find it vaguely dissatisfying that with the structured and hierarchical organization, the URLs don't convey that affordance

also decent weight still goes to URL keywords in SERPs

(and yes, many to many links to leaves attached more than one place seems a problem, but that's what canonical URLs are for)

Re: Launch HN: Dendron (YC W21) – Structured note-taking for developers and teams

#66
post #61

Only reason I don't use Dendron more is because I'm not a fan of VS Code. Just not for me I guess. Something I've been exploring is using Dendron on my desktop at work (with dual monitors) and Obsidian on my Chromebook. I convert the notes from both into a TiddlyWiki site and view/query them at the same time. Apologies for interrupting the casual dismissals.

What is TiddlyWiki good for?

Things which are deeply intertwingled. Joe Armstrong (Erlang) gave at least one talk about it, available on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uv1UfLPK7_Q

The key points were that Wikipedia style wikis force you into a page-at-a-time model. And TiddlyWiki uses more like a post-it-note sized amount of information. Wikipedia has a few links, TiddlyWiki items would have dense links to other notes. Then the experience of reading something would be like a 'choose your own adventure' book - click on a link and you don't get whisked away to a new page with all the context lost, you get the next note appearing below. It's building on the work of Ted Nelson and the early HyperText dreams from before the Web.

As you click and explore, you build up a longer page of just the ideas and content you want, and don't have to write huge topic-wide essays and browse huge topic-wide pages all in one go. He called it "the correct level of granularity, deeply intertwingled".

There were probably other important points I've forgotten.

Relevantly for Dendron, the slide I've clicked onto in the YouTube has a quote: "Hierarchical and sequential structures are usually forced and artificial. People keep pretending they can make things hierarchical, categorizable and sequential when they can't" - Ted Nelson, 1974.

Re: Launch HN: Dendron (YC W21) – Structured note-taking for developers and teams

#67
post #61

Only reason I don't use Dendron more is because I'm not a fan of VS Code. Just not for me I guess. Something I've been exploring is using Dendron on my desktop at work (with dual monitors) and Obsidian on my Chromebook. I convert the notes from both into a TiddlyWiki site and view/query them at the same time. Apologies for interrupting the casual dismissals.

What is TiddlyWiki good for?

What I'm referring to here is converting markdown files to individual tiddlers. You get tags, backlinks, filters, etc. for free. I have an automated process that lets me put files created multiple ways in multiple directories in a single wiki. That gives me a dashboard of everything. I'm not a fan of entering notes in TW, but I really like querying and reading my notes that way.

Re: Launch HN: Dendron (YC W21) – Structured note-taking for developers and teams

#68

This is exactly what I'm looking for! After creating hundreds of markdown notes with Obsidian, it became rather hard to sift through and query knowledge. I can't wait to try Dendron out!

I've been a fan of combining the use of Obsidian and Dendron, too. I use Obsidian on my phone, with MGit (Android) for the git management, and Dendron on the desktop. The combination of Obsidian (for mobile) + Dendron (for desktop) pops up in the Dendron community discord from time to time, and the common response tends positive when it comes to that workflow

Re: Launch HN: Dendron (YC W21) – Structured note-taking for developers and teams

#69
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is TiddlyWiki good for?

Things which are deeply intertwingled. Joe Armstrong (Erlang) gave at least one talk about it, available on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uv1UfLPK7_Q The key points were that Wikipedia style wikis force you into a page-at-a-time model. And TiddlyWiki uses more like a post-it-note sized amount of information. Wikipedia has a few links, TiddlyWiki items would have dense links to other notes. Then the experie…

I was a big user of tiddly wiki back in the day and a fan of the work. One point of distinction for Dendron - we are hierarchy oriented but support other means of organization (tags, backlinks, graphs, etc).

If you're trying to create a model of the real world, you probably want to use a graph primitive to capture the nuances. But that flexibility is what makes things hard for humans - since a note can exist in N places, how do you find it? How do you even know you've tagged/linked it correctly?

Dendron's constraint of hierarchy is one of those "its not a bug but a feature" things - the constraint of hierarchy makes it easy for humans to reason about. What we add on top of that is the ability to refactor that hierarchy when necessary

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