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USC pushed a $115k online degree – graduates got low salaries, huge debts

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Re: USC pushed a $115k online degree – graduates got low salaries, huge debts

#241

Post by mrep »

Axien wrote: post #75
woeirua wrote: post #64

The only way to effectively address the college tuition bubble is going to be for Congress to pass a law that caps the amount of student loans that someone can draw to be proportional to their expected salary over X years on a per-school, per-program basis. That would put a lot of pressure on underperforming programs and schools to produce better value for their students, either by improving outcomes, or by reducing…

Too complicated. I would make a rule that any Bachelors program costing more than 15k is ineligible for student loans. Magically those $60k programs will fall to $15k. The reason college is so expensive is because that is what people are willing to take loans to cover.

Then kids from poor parents won't be able to go to the top programs because the top programs won't reduce their rates because they will still be able to get their high fees from rich parents and they won't want to make their school worse at least perceptibly so if they have to cut a bunch of costs.

Re: USC pushed a $115k online degree – graduates got low salaries, huge debts

#242

Post by mrep »

clairity wrote: post #97
colinmhayes wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

USC is just as prestigious as UCLA. They've easily got the most prestigious film program in the world.

usc is a money-oriented pay-for-prestige institution, and most folks know it, which is why it always lags ucla (and others) in prestige outside of the cinema school (even that has been bought, by old-money hollywood). other programs, like engineering, are solid, but suffer from the overall shallowness of usc’s image, as well as the many scandals that have further tarnished the brand.

My dad always called it university of spoiled children.

Re: USC pushed a $115k online degree – graduates got low salaries, huge debts

#243

Post by MandieD »

mrep wrote: post #239
tharkun__ wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This might be a very unpopular opinion here. I'll mention it anyway. Free tuition. Germany has had zero tuition university for quite some time. And though they allowed charging tuition again a while ago, it was capped at something like 600EUR (?) per semester. Many universities apparently also went back to not charging tuition again. It works well enough if you ask me. I got a great education with zero student debt.…

I don't think it is very controversial to increase funding for public state schools so that they can lower prices. USC though is a private school that costs a ridiculous $81,659 a year [0] and I don't want my tax dollars paying that much to a private institution. [0]: https://admission.usc.edu/learn/cost-financial-aid/

I’ve spent the past decade in the IT department of a really big German company Americans outside of the auto industry have probably never heard of, and I have yet to meet a German colleague who went to a private university, even up through our CEO.

The very concept of student loans is mind-boggling for them.

Re: USC pushed a $115k online degree – graduates got low salaries, huge debts

#244

Post by Ekaros »

brutal_chaos_ wrote: post #187
yumraj wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> having a hard cap of 100k unless enrolling in a high paid field ( Dr , Lawyer, anything that requires a state sanctioned license) would be a good idea. I think you have a valid point, which probably got missed in the rest of your comment. Why are student loans not tied to the value of the program, which determines their ability to pay? I cannot get a $100K loan for a Corolla nor can I get $5 million loan for a $500…

How would humanities, arts, pure reasearch and the like survive in this model?

Do they deserve to survive? Maybe state could subsidise certain number of positions. And distribute them by something fair like SAT score or proper objectively measured entrance exams.

Re: USC pushed a $115k online degree – graduates got low salaries, huge debts

#245

Post by culopatin »

EduToss wrote: post #206
parm289 wrote: post #123

Perhaps a bit off topic, but seeing the breadth of general discussion about online CS masters programs in this thread, figured I'd ask the HN crowd: How is a program like the Penn MCIT Online degree[0] viewed by engineering and product hiring teams in industry? I am looking at transitioning from venture capital investing to SWE (and potentially product, given my business background) and this seems like a good option…

Throwaway as have done work slightly related to this industry. I looked in to MCIT online but the outcomes appeared to be very mediocre. One of the testimonials was a student who got a job in sales at a tech company. A big tell is if you go to their outcomes page it is a bit embarrassing in the lack of anything to boast about. https://online.seas.upenn.edu/degrees/mcit-online/outcomes/ First testimonial: "Halfway thr…

Wow that is such a weak statement that I would be embarrassed to write it. “Considering applying”. Not even considering an offer. They are not even sure if they should apply? How is that an outcome you want to publish?

Re: USC pushed a $115k online degree – graduates got low salaries, huge debts

#246

Post by [deleted] »

999900000999 wrote: post #106

Ehh eh. I went to a CSU for like 6k a year. If you want to be elitist and attend the most expensive school possible, you have to eventually pay for it. > Ms. Fowler, a 2018 graduate, enjoyed the program but owes $307,000 in total student-loan debt, including about $200,000 from the master’s degree. She said she earns $48,000 as a community mental-health therapist in Mount Pleasant, Iowa. This translates into paying 3…

[deleted]

Re: USC pushed a $115k online degree – graduates got low salaries, huge debts

#247

Post by kongolongo »

999900000999 wrote: post #106

Ehh eh. I went to a CSU for like 6k a year. If you want to be elitist and attend the most expensive school possible, you have to eventually pay for it. > Ms. Fowler, a 2018 graduate, enjoyed the program but owes $307,000 in total student-loan debt, including about $200,000 from the master’s degree. She said she earns $48,000 as a community mental-health therapist in Mount Pleasant, Iowa. This translates into paying 3…

>The problem with Student Loan forgiveness is it would typically help the highest paid Americans. Most people with 100k plus in loans also make very good money.

That's very true. People often don't realize that blanket loan forgiveness is a very regressive policy. The higher you go up in the income bracket, the higher share of the student loan debt. Some kind of income-based or extreme situational (life-changing events, health, etc) forgiveness would be much better.

>Why in God's name would you go 300k in debt to make 50k ?

True especially for a masters program you should be well into early adulthood and it's even more difficult to argue that you were too young to understand the consequences. Schools publish their students past and expected incomes. Unless you have a good reason to believe you are exceptional, those numbers should definitely be used for planning your academic path.

Re: USC pushed a $115k online degree – graduates got low salaries, huge debts

#248

Post by dagw »

MandieD wrote: post #243
mrep wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it is very controversial to increase funding for public state schools so that they can lower prices. USC though is a private school that costs a ridiculous $81,659 a year [0] and I don't want my tax dollars paying that much to a private institution. [0]: https://admission.usc.edu/learn/cost-financial-aid/

I’ve spent the past decade in the IT department of a really big German company Americans outside of the auto industry have probably never heard of, and I have yet to meet a German colleague who went to a private university, even up through our CEO. The very concept of student loans is mind-boggling for them.

The very concept of student loans is mind-boggling for them.

I only know how it works in Norway, Sweden and Denmark, but students loans are super common there. Even though tuition is free you still have food, rent, books and other living expenses that all have to be paid for. How do most German students pay those costs?

Re: USC pushed a $115k online degree – graduates got low salaries, huge debts

#249

Post by Whinner »

mikemac wrote: post #137
Whinner wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They also started an online MS in Cybersecurity in 2019. Three different tracks. The policy track only needs 1 CS'ish class. The Information Security track students would probably be better off just going for the MS in CS instead. A lot of students start in the Information Security track but switch over to Policy once they take the intro to info security class. All the classes in the Info Sec track are the same as th…

I assume you're in the CS track? How do you like it so far, and was your undergrad in CS?

I'm in the Cybersecurity, Information Security Track. My undergrad was Business Administration. It's been a struggle trying to learn things as I go but so far no issues. I personally feel the MS in CS would be more valuable, but I never thought I would have been accepted into the program. I was accepted into the first semester of the MS in Cyber MS. If I had known that I would be successful, I would have applied to the CS degree years ago.

Re: USC pushed a $115k online degree – graduates got low salaries, huge debts

#250

Post by voakbasda »

david38 wrote: post #226
rsj_hn wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't have it both ways. Either allow the government to turn down most of these loans and charge higher interest rates based on credit-worthiness or make bankruptcy very difficult. What you want is the bankrupcty rights of a non-government guaranteed loan in which credit worthiness is taken into account, but interest rates and credit availability of a loan in which the bankruptcy rights are substantially reduced.…

Few things are black and white. I absolutely believe in bankruptcy. I also believe the government can fund state schools and community colleges in such a way as to improve access without building more palaces. Just by improving the rigor of community colleges students can save massive amounts of money by paying $2k/y instead of $30k and live at home instead of $15k for housing. This cuts the cost basically in half.

You think I’d let my kids live with me for less than $200/month?
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