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Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

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Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#291

Post by zsmi »

twox2 wrote: post #228
a_t48 wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've interviewed at Google twice - passed once, declined continuing the process due to not being super interested in the product. I've declined interviewing at Facebook/Amazon. I haven't talked with Netflix nor Apple. I have not worked for one, but have never gotten any indication that the lack of diploma would be a problem. I gather that a decade of professional experience makes the lack of diploma irrelevant. As be…

My anecdotal data is that I went really far in the process with a FAANG, got a verbal offer, and it was rescinded (never got the official offer). I always suspected it was due to lack of a degree. And no one explicitly ever asked, but they did ask for a rather detailed work/education history, and I never claimed to have one. I really suspect that they SAY they don't care if you have a degree or not, but at the end of…

Was it in California and what year was it? It's well known in the valley recruiters from various companies put the kibosh on many offers to prevent talent from moving around. There were some big lawsuits on it.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#292

Post by Karrot_Kream »

thriftwy wrote: post #262
simonh wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

facebook is hiring 10,000 developers in the EU to build the Metaverse. https://www.reuters.com/technology/facebook-plans-hire-10000... My daughter is looking to go into software engineering and I was explaining to her that most of the high paying jobs are in the US and there's a big brain drain out of Europe (we're Brits). Not to dissuade her, but that she might consider that as an option on graduation. I was specula…

They do hire in Europe but pick expensive locales such as Switzerland, London or Dublin. I can't stop wondering why not open shop in Italy or Spain - wages may be much lower with way higher life quality.

We've tried hiring in these locations (Italy and Spain) with some success, but it's pretty tough because the talent pool is so small. At some point, you weigh whether the lower cost of the salary is worth the extra time/effort spent adding headcount. Which is funny because we have no shortage of Italian and Spanish devs applying for our expensive European city offices. I don't know European urban dynamics that well, but it certainly seems to me, off the cuff at least, that Europeans want to live in high COL European cities as much as Americans want to live in high COL American cities.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#293

Post by lmarcos »

foobarian wrote: post #279
lmarcos wrote: post #216

As a developer working in Europe, I would love to work for an American company and make 30 to 50% more. But, it's difficult: - I don't really want to adapt myself to their timezone. Perhaps 1 or 2 or hours of shift from my tz, but not more - I don't want to work as a contractor. I want to be an employee - I want at least 28 business days of vacation per year - I do 9 to 5. No more, no less. I'm not in my 20s anymore…

As far as the TZ issue, I just wanted to mention that it is possible a company could really appreciate having you stay on your normal schedule if you have an operational role, because it helps extend coverage and saves US based folks from shifting their schedules.

That's actually a good point! I could put that on my CV :D

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#294

Post by alistairSH »

anon-686876876 wrote: post #188
alistairSH wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not just the $60k developer in Sleepville, USA. Salaries in Bangalore have literally sky-rocketed.

Launching money into space is unlikely to help the situation.

That's about what it feels like dealing with comp over there. It's really insane. Great for the locals. Frustrating trying to hire and retain them from the US.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#295

Post by Animats »

simonh wrote: post #203
BiteCode_dev wrote: post #161

Except: - no country pay like the US. Worked for silicon valley companies remotely, and made twice the money I made in France, while being 3 times cheaper than local competition. - no country have the volume of hi-level coding gig job offers the US has. - few countries even have has many interesting projects. If you want to code in Haskell or Lisp in Europe, good luck. - the USA don't care about your diploma, only wh…

facebook is hiring 10,000 developers in the EU to build the Metaverse. https://www.reuters.com/technology/facebook-plans-hire-10000... My daughter is looking to go into software engineering and I was explaining to her that most of the high paying jobs are in the US and there's a big brain drain out of Europe (we're Brits). Not to dissuade her, but that she might consider that as an option on graduation. I was specula…

Probably mostly censors. Roblox has about 4000 censors, outsourced to low-wage countries.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#296

Post by brianmcc »

initplus wrote: post #267
sparsely wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The payroll, taxes, and labour laws are a big barrier at the moment. Even if you are happy hiring someone as an independent contractor to simplify the first two, how do you know that you aren't breaking local laws, e.g. about disguised employment? You still have to be familiar with local laws and regulations. It seems like something that an intermediary could help with, and a few do exist, although they are pricey. S…

If you can outcompete local rates by 30%+, why would your employees complain about disguised employment? Labour laws generally come into play when professions are poorly compensated or mistreated - pampered tech contractors being paid far above local market rate don't really fall into that category.

The "independent contractor" bit of parent's post is what's relevant here.

In the UK the Government has clamped down on freelancing by saying, simplified grossly, if you look and act like an employee, but claim to be an independent contractor using alternative and often more favourable remuneration strategies, then you'll be firmly disagreed with and instead you'll be considered an employee.

The Govt considers this "disguised employment", not the freelancer.

More on this: https://www.gov.uk/guidance/understanding-off-payroll-workin...

But it's the key point parent is making - you need to know about this stuff for bringing in freelance talent in/from the UK. Not least because as a hirer/commissioning party the UK Govt will come after you if you have got it wrong!

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#297

Post by rolisz »

initplus wrote: post #267
sparsely wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The payroll, taxes, and labour laws are a big barrier at the moment. Even if you are happy hiring someone as an independent contractor to simplify the first two, how do you know that you aren't breaking local laws, e.g. about disguised employment? You still have to be familiar with local laws and regulations. It seems like something that an intermediary could help with, and a few do exist, although they are pricey. S…

If you can outcompete local rates by 30%+, why would your employees complain about disguised employment? Labour laws generally come into play when professions are poorly compensated or mistreated - pampered tech contractors being paid far above local market rate don't really fall into that category.

In Romania ar least, the equivalent of the IRS doesn't like the disguised employment, because it leads to much lower taxes (8% vs 35%). There are around 7 criteria which are used to determine if a relationship is of employment or not. If they say you fulfil enough of those criteria, even if your contract is a freelance contract, you/the employer will have to pay the extra taxes.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#298

Post by postsantum »

standardUser wrote: post #240
thriftwy wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

USA is super expensive. Yes you can get a large paycheck, wait until you see house prices. Also current situation does not inspire confidence in somebody who may be identified as white male.

White males are one of the highest paid demographic groups in the US and always have been.

It seems white americans are far behind many asian ethnic groups

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_groups_in_the_U...

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#299

Post by distances »

moooo99 wrote: post #290
distances wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What's more, as soon as US companies hire remotely en masse in Europe, regulators there will surely demand the same benefits & protections for their people from remote employers. If US company doesn't have a local office in that European country they can't anyway offer a normal employment contract, that has never been possible. Social security, healthcare, pension needs to be paid. So either the employee is a freel…

> Social security, healthcare, pension needs to be paid. So either the employee is a freelancer, or company has an office in the same country to pay the employer's dues. This is important! The labor market in most EU countries is very strictly regulated, mostly to the benefit of the employees. If the company you try to work for does not have a branch in your country (chances are, they don't) then there is a huge bure…

> Speaking from a German perspective, its barely worth it to try to apply for a remote position at [..] As a contractor

You have to deal with more paperwork, but in my experience it definitely is worth the trouble to become an independent contractor in Germany -- also if you work only for local companies. Generally with local work you can expect to earn at least double as a freelancer, though I'm sure there are some niches that pay well also for regular employment positions.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#300

Post by bsagdiyev »

thriftwy wrote: post #207
BiteCode_dev wrote: post #161

Except: - no country pay like the US. Worked for silicon valley companies remotely, and made twice the money I made in France, while being 3 times cheaper than local competition. - no country have the volume of hi-level coding gig job offers the US has. - few countries even have has many interesting projects. If you want to code in Haskell or Lisp in Europe, good luck. - the USA don't care about your diploma, only wh…

USA is super expensive. Yes you can get a large paycheck, wait until you see house prices. Also current situation does not inspire confidence in somebody who may be identified as white male.

House prices where? We got our house for 345k and I earn 100k+ in North Carolina. Not everyone needs to live in California.
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