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Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

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Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#231

Post by saiya-jin »

thriftwy wrote: post #207
BiteCode_dev wrote: post #161

Except: - no country pay like the US. Worked for silicon valley companies remotely, and made twice the money I made in France, while being 3 times cheaper than local competition. - no country have the volume of hi-level coding gig job offers the US has. - few countries even have has many interesting projects. If you want to code in Haskell or Lisp in Europe, good luck. - the USA don't care about your diploma, only wh…

USA is super expensive. Yes you can get a large paycheck, wait until you see house prices. Also current situation does not inspire confidence in somebody who may be identified as white male.

If you want to be located in a place which pays relatively high in Europe, housing prices are adequate. 10-15 years ago it would be possible to have disproportionally large salary in eastern places like Prague, but that's history now.

Even if it still costs less than SF, your paycheck now looks adequate. Covid era raised prices everywhere.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#232

Post by LegitShady »

kelnos wrote: post #141
zcw100 wrote: post #138

Much ado about nothing. Developer jobs have been able to be outsourced and work remote for a couple of decades. If it was going to go that way it would have long ago. The rest of the world might be catching up to the remote work game but software development has been there, done that. If anything we've already experienced a pullback where outsourced developer jobs have been pulled back when they experienced the probl…

Agreed. The "worst" I see happening is some US tech jobs will go to Canada, since the time zones are "compatible" and culture is similar. People from Central and South America will get in the game somewhat as well, but I still think cultural and language barriers cause enough problems that there's still a bit of a moat. We've already been offshoring to Asia and Eastern Europe for decades now, and even though we shoul…

All the qualified Canadians move to the USA for USA incomes. Canada is going to be an immigration station for people companies want to bring in but can't get US visas for. Its already a thing.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#233

Post by cblconfederate »

lmarcos wrote: post #216

As a developer working in Europe, I would love to work for an American company and make 30 to 50% more. But, it's difficult: - I don't really want to adapt myself to their timezone. Perhaps 1 or 2 or hours of shift from my tz, but not more - I don't want to work as a contractor. I want to be an employee - I want at least 28 business days of vacation per year - I do 9 to 5. No more, no less. I'm not in my 20s anymore…

Where in Europe? Rich Europe or poor Europe?

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#234

Post by whateveracct »

exdsq wrote: post #219
BiteCode_dev wrote: post #161

Except: - no country pay like the US. Worked for silicon valley companies remotely, and made twice the money I made in France, while being 3 times cheaper than local competition. - no country have the volume of hi-level coding gig job offers the US has. - few countries even have has many interesting projects. If you want to code in Haskell or Lisp in Europe, good luck. - the USA don't care about your diploma, only wh…

These are all subjective. I worked on Haskell, without a degree, on interesting problems for an NY salary remotely out of my bedroom in Oxford. I have since moved to the Bay Area and am working for an Eastern European country while earning a Bay Area rate.

For something like Haskell, you can definitely negotiate that kind of thing if you have some experience. Those skills are highly coveted and valued if you know your worth imo.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#235

Post by jmgao »

mrguyorama wrote: post #148
GekkePrutser wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They also seem to work very long hours with long commutes and get few vacations. When I see that the average cost of a house in Cupertino is 2.5 million dollars for example, I would imagine most of those Apple engineers live far away.

Never forget that "Free Dinner" is a big "perk" of work in FAANG land. I can't comprehend the messed up work life balance that makes that make sense

Why not? The vast majority of people who ate dinner at Google immediately went home afterwards. My daily routine was to show up at 11, check email, eat lunch, work until 6:30ish, eat dinner, and then go home.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#236

Post by filoleg »

exdsq wrote: post #219
BiteCode_dev wrote: post #161

Except: - no country pay like the US. Worked for silicon valley companies remotely, and made twice the money I made in France, while being 3 times cheaper than local competition. - no country have the volume of hi-level coding gig job offers the US has. - few countries even have has many interesting projects. If you want to code in Haskell or Lisp in Europe, good luck. - the USA don't care about your diploma, only wh…

These are all subjective. I worked on Haskell, without a degree, on interesting problems for an NY salary remotely out of my bedroom in Oxford. I have since moved to the Bay Area and am working for an Eastern European country while earning a Bay Area rate.

>I have since moved to the Bay Area and am working for an Eastern European country while earning a Bay Area rate.

If I understood it correctly, you physically live in Bay Area while working remotely for a company located in Eastern Europe, and you are earning Bay Area rates? This seems like the complete inverse of the situation I usually hear of (working for a Bay Area company remotely in a cheaper area and earning Bay Area rates).

Out of pure curiosity, do you mind sharing the name of that Eastern European company? Totally understandable if you aren't willing to do so, but I have a feeling that there is probably literally 1 or 2 companies tops that would be willing to do that, so it isn't really an option for almost anyone. The first two that popped into my mind were Yandex and, to a much lesser degree, VK.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#237

Post by brianmcc »

bluedino wrote: post #132
brianmcc wrote: post #29

I am sceptical. Reminds me of the predictions 20 years ago that outsourcing/offshoring would eliminate hands-on developer jobs in US/UK and other "expensive" countries. Timezones, language factors, cultural factors, retention and exclusivity challenges plus basic logistics stuff like payroll and taxes all matter a lot. None of that's insurmountable but it takes a level of effort that can be very high. And I say this…

>> outsourcing/offshoring would eliminate hands-on developer jobs in US/UK and other "expensive" countries Remember companies like EDS? During the 80's and 90's all the development and support for the 'big' companies in the USA was done by companies like EDS. They employed hundreds of thousands of people. Then in 2000's they started going to India etc.

Oh totally. But hands-on tech jobs in the USA aren't eliminated, the sector is buoyant!

Colleagues in India feel like colleagues not "replacements" these days.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#238

Post by brianmcc »

zz865 wrote: post #126
brianmcc wrote: post #29

I am sceptical. Reminds me of the predictions 20 years ago that outsourcing/offshoring would eliminate hands-on developer jobs in US/UK and other "expensive" countries. Timezones, language factors, cultural factors, retention and exclusivity challenges plus basic logistics stuff like payroll and taxes all matter a lot. None of that's insurmountable but it takes a level of effort that can be very high. And I say this…

> Reminds me of the predictions 20 years ago that outsourcing/offshoring would eliminate hands-on developer jobs in US/UK and other "expensive" countries. Well in the corporate world offshoring really is everywhere. Even Goldman Sach's, #2 office for engineers in is Bangalore.

Sure but my main point is that hands-on tech jobs in NY, SF, London, etc, remain plentiful.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#239

Post by mmalachowski »

wesnerm2 wrote: post #226
lmarcos wrote: post #216

As a developer working in Europe, I would love to work for an American company and make 30 to 50% more. But, it's difficult: - I don't really want to adapt myself to their timezone. Perhaps 1 or 2 or hours of shift from my tz, but not more - I don't want to work as a contractor. I want to be an employee - I want at least 28 business days of vacation per year - I do 9 to 5. No more, no less. I'm not in my 20s anymore…

You should not make any assumptions about work in the US. There's many American software companies that are able to fulfill your requirements. In many tech companies, you have "unlimited" vacation. You can probably take more vacation that you already get in Europe. This is true of my company, mParticle. I can work 9-to-5 as an employee. That is the culture of the company that I work for. People can choose to work rem…

By "vacation" you mean fully paid days ? Unlimited?

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#240

Post by standardUser »

thriftwy wrote: post #207
BiteCode_dev wrote: post #161

Except: - no country pay like the US. Worked for silicon valley companies remotely, and made twice the money I made in France, while being 3 times cheaper than local competition. - no country have the volume of hi-level coding gig job offers the US has. - few countries even have has many interesting projects. If you want to code in Haskell or Lisp in Europe, good luck. - the USA don't care about your diploma, only wh…

USA is super expensive. Yes you can get a large paycheck, wait until you see house prices. Also current situation does not inspire confidence in somebody who may be identified as white male.

White males are one of the highest paid demographic groups in the US and always have been.
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