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Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

devonzuegel.com

211–220 of 534 posts

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#211
post #174
post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No diploma here - still have recruiters from at least 3 of the 5 messaging me. Edit: downvoters, care to explain a little? Why would they waste their time on me if they weren't interested in me working there?

Do you / have you ever worked at one?

I have worked for FAANG without a diploma. While it is rare, you can definitely do it if you grind enough leet code :D

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I've heard about a classist element in Europe that might make the path I took unlikely. I dropped out of college, toiled in the service industry for 10 years, got sick of it, went to code school, got a tech job and 6 years later earn $130k. Still no degree. Is it true you can't do that there or is that just a stereotype?

You can, but in France you would have to go freelance, as I did. There would be no way to charge what I make if I were an employee. In fact, most companies would not give me the level of responsability I had as a junior freelance, even today. And yet, it's better in IT than in any other field. You already make more money, and the requirements are relaxed compared to other sectors. I some countries, like the UK (well,…

True, that. You can make good money as a dev in finance here in London. Not as much as in the US, but better than most of Europe.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#213
There’s two directions to it. I’ve read crowing articles via HN about how it opens the US up to hiring from the world, it also opens up the world to hiring from the rest of the world and from the US.

It’s not just “outsourcing” that’s gone remote, it’s key players and teams. That’s a big difference from earlier waves.

The ability to pay and live appropriately will be the chief determinator. US companies might pay better on average, but we may start seeing larger and brighter sparks elsewhere in the world.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#215
post #141
post #138

Much ado about nothing. Developer jobs have been able to be outsourced and work remote for a couple of decades. If it was going to go that way it would have long ago. The rest of the world might be catching up to the remote work game but software development has been there, done that. If anything we've already experienced a pullback where outsourced developer jobs have been pulled back when they experienced the probl…

Agreed. The "worst" I see happening is some US tech jobs will go to Canada, since the time zones are "compatible" and culture is similar. People from Central and South America will get in the game somewhat as well, but I still think cultural and language barriers cause enough problems that there's still a bit of a moat. We've already been offshoring to Asia and Eastern Europe for decades now, and even though we shoul…

Language and cultural barriers are not a problem if you hire people to directly work in the team.

They are not problem if you do hiring directly and select right people.

Biggest problem is that companies want to hire bunch of worm bodies and dump trash tasks on them.

Managers expect that they will be able to throw vague requirements and bunch of people who are not part of their company will figure out what to do. What is especially funny that bad things happen even with people inside companies when manager tries to just throw vague requirements at dev team.

It is also problem with big "software houses" where you hire bunch of people - nowadays people have good internet at homes are much more conscious and one can hire specialists directly from other country and skip BS providers.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#216
As a developer working in Europe, I would love to work for an American company and make 30 to 50% more. But, it's difficult:

- I don't really want to adapt myself to their timezone. Perhaps 1 or 2 or hours of shift from my tz, but not more

- I don't want to work as a contractor. I want to be an employee

- I want at least 28 business days of vacation per year

- I do 9 to 5. No more, no less. I'm not in my 20s anymore

Because of the reasons above I don't even care looking for remote positions in American companies (which are scarce already).

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#217
post #141
post #138

Much ado about nothing. Developer jobs have been able to be outsourced and work remote for a couple of decades. If it was going to go that way it would have long ago. The rest of the world might be catching up to the remote work game but software development has been there, done that. If anything we've already experienced a pullback where outsourced developer jobs have been pulled back when they experienced the probl…

Agreed. The "worst" I see happening is some US tech jobs will go to Canada, since the time zones are "compatible" and culture is similar. People from Central and South America will get in the game somewhat as well, but I still think cultural and language barriers cause enough problems that there's still a bit of a moat. We've already been offshoring to Asia and Eastern Europe for decades now, and even though we shoul…

time zones are probably the biggest issue i see coming up.

as someone in PST/PDT with a sleep disorder, its pretty easy to work with east coast people. i've had a boss in the UK before and it worked because he was okay with ending his day with a 6pm meeting his time. but working with people on india time is going to be a mess one way or the other.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#218
post #7

I don't buy it, US tech salaries continue to skyrocket and we're nearly two years into pandemic conditions. Just over the last 6-9 months, salaries have markedly jumped. There's still a huge thirst for talent that isn't being quenched, and global pools don't help either. Facebook, Google and others have satellite offices all over to soak up talent elsewhere, but they're still ultra competitive in the US. They can pay…

> They can pay a senior engineer $350k in the US, or an equivalent experience senior engineer $100k in Europe. Why can they do this?

They can do whatever they want. You accuse others of being patronizing but your sense of entitlement is polarizing. It would do you well to realize that the US pays a lot for software engineering as a result of the same societal structure, policies, and priorities that cause the problems Europeans love picking on (e.g. healthcare, paid time off, parental leave, etc).

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#219

Except: - no country pay like the US. Worked for silicon valley companies remotely, and made twice the money I made in France, while being 3 times cheaper than local competition. - no country have the volume of hi-level coding gig job offers the US has. - few countries even have has many interesting projects. If you want to code in Haskell or Lisp in Europe, good luck. - the USA don't care about your diploma, only wh…

These are all subjective. I worked on Haskell, without a degree, on interesting problems for an NY salary remotely out of my bedroom in Oxford. I have since moved to the Bay Area and am working for an Eastern European country while earning a Bay Area rate.

Re: Remote work will break the US monopoly on global talent

#220

It's happening on Brazil I think. It's very hard to hire for brazilian companies since people can earn an extraordinary salary by working remote. Our timezone is also pretty close to the US east coast, and still not that far from SV.

Also Argentina. I've worked with several very talented developers remote from Argentina. UTC-3.

+1 for Argentina. There's an argument from the book Germs, Guns, Steel that in the past civilizations flourished most where geography allowed for trade to happen at roughly the same latitude, where all the same crops would grow and could spread - for example, Europe and the fertile crescent, which is in contrast to the Americas and Africa. Now there seems to be a opposite effect happening along longitudes around remote work because of time zones, and I would expect South America, despite the lower % of English speakers, to be at least as big of a receiver of SV benefits as Europe in the short term and probably bigger over the long term.
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