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Ask HN: Could VSCode be the new Emacs?

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Re: Ask HN: Could VSCode be the new Emacs?

#31

Post by bjackman »

Data point: I've been using Emacs for about 5 hears. I've got a setup that works very well for me but every time I open my .emacs I hate Emacs lisp even more. Decided to give VSCode a go, my take is:

- It's really slow (noticable keyboard latency) and this bums me out.

- Haven't yet got into a proper VSCode git plugin but I'm pretty sure when I do I'll still miss Magit.

- The only place where I really miss Emacs' ultra flexibility is the window management. VSCode's model is pretty simplistic and seems dumb to me.

On the whole with my hatred of ELisp I think the relative inflexibility of VSCode is a wash, especially when you factor in how easy it was to get started. But it does make me sad to know if I stick with it I'll never escape the slowness.

Re: Ask HN: Could VSCode be the new Emacs?

#32

Post by WithinReason »

kangaroopouch wrote: post #9

> But are there any other reasons, technical or otherwise, why people don't seem to use VSCode for things beyond editing code? The best answer I've seen to this question is https://www.murilopereira.com/the-values-of-emacs-the-neovim... Amongst other things, it lists different values that each tool prioritizes, and how "Core values are self-reinforcing. They attract like-minded people, who will then defend them." Ema…

This is a great point, however the number of users of VSCode is so high (71% of StackOverflow users in 2021 [0]) that it's unlikely that it's only attracting users with a certain set of values.

[0]: https://insights.stackoverflow.com/survey/2021#section-most-...

Re: Ask HN: Could VSCode be the new Emacs?

#33

Post by LeonidasXIV »

arvinsim wrote: post #25
saurik wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Some people like customizing the heck out of their editor, getting super deep into metaprogramming and macros. You will hopefully be programming for decades: I have been programming already for three decades and I expect I will be programming for another two before my mind gives out (if I am lucky, I might get another four). Customize your tools: they are yours, and being able to continue using and improving your w…

If I work on different environments or desks, customization is the last thing I want. I would rather have sane defaults and start being productive immediately.

The same argument could be taken to the absurd by saying you only use notepad or nano because they're likely to be installed already so you can be immediately productive.

Re: Ask HN: Could VSCode be the new Emacs?

#34

Post by varjag »

arvinsim wrote: post #25
saurik wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Some people like customizing the heck out of their editor, getting super deep into metaprogramming and macros. You will hopefully be programming for decades: I have been programming already for three decades and I expect I will be programming for another two before my mind gives out (if I am lucky, I might get another four). Customize your tools: they are yours, and being able to continue using and improving your w…

If I work on different environments or desks, customization is the last thing I want. I would rather have sane defaults and start being productive immediately.

A 20Kb .emacs file isn't that much to carry around.

Re: Ask HN: Could VSCode be the new Emacs?

#35

Post by anothernewdude »

havkd wrote: post #20

I’ve wanted to switch to emacs for a long time, but it feels like a second or third class citizen on Windows. There are many guides online on how to prepare it to be used as an IDE for different programming languages but it all breaks down when you try to follow the guides on Windows. On the other hand vscode is first class, or almost.

Funny, I feel like a second class citizen whenever I use windows.

Re: Ask HN: Could VSCode be the new Emacs?

#37

Post by alfiedotwtf »

Long term risk management!

99% of my time in front of the computer is spent in an editor (for both work and play). Having invested and continuing to invest so much time and effort in my tools and my environment, I would hate for something so fundamental in my life to not be free as in freedom:

    "Microsoft's releases of Visual Studio Code are licensed
     under this not-FLOSS license and contain telemetry/tracking"

    https://code.visualstudio.com/license
By choosing open source, you can reduce the amount of carpet pulled out from under you.

Re: Ask HN: Could VSCode be the new Emacs?

#38

Post by pizza234 »

LeonidasXIV wrote: post #33
arvinsim wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I work on different environments or desks, customization is the last thing I want. I would rather have sane defaults and start being productive immediately.

The same argument could be taken to the absurd by saying you only use notepad or nano because they're likely to be installed already so you can be immediately productive.

Even if the argument is taken to the absurd, the parent's approach can still be valid; if the user worked on an infinite number of environments (remember, this is the assumption of the parent poster), it'd be overall more productive to use barebone tools with zero learning overhead, rather than spending infinite time with the learning overhead of the infinite environments.

The core point is overall productivity; it may still be more productive overall not to know some tools extremely well.

Re: Ask HN: Could VSCode be the new Emacs?

#39

Post by alkonaut »

saurik wrote: post #19
kortex wrote: post #11

I think so, but prepare for people to come out of the woodwork with all kinds of reasons why their workflow is the _one true way_. Some people like customizing the heck out of their editor, getting super deep into metaprogramming and macros. Personally, I don't really have time for that. I want an editor which does 95% of what I want out of the box. For me, that's pycharm, but vscode is really nice as well. It feels…

> Some people like customizing the heck out of their editor, getting super deep into metaprogramming and macros. You will hopefully be programming for decades: I have been programming already for three decades and I expect I will be programming for another two before my mind gives out (if I am lucky, I might get another four). Customize your tools: they are yours, and being able to continue using and improving your w…

> Customize your tools: they are yours, and being able to continue using and improving your workflow over time isn't a distraction if you are in this for the long haul.

I have programmed for 20 years professionally (and a few more). I have the exact opposite approach. I don't even learn ketyboard shortcuts, would never customize my environment even a little (like moving a tool window around in an IDE) because it just doesn't stick. The difference in philosophy is probably because I'm a windows dev and I just don't have (or trust) there to be a persistent settings storage. The small papercuts of not customization it is less annoying than the constant re-customization required when it keeps breaking, or you use a different machine. There is no real dotfile system, the user profile directory is a mess and even if it is, applications usually don't bother to maintain their settings and compatibility. So my philosophy has basically become: change nothing, and everything will look your way even on a clean system (and after the next upgrade).

Re: Ask HN: Could VSCode be the new Emacs?

#40

Post by [deleted] »

qsort wrote: post #2

A Unix novice came to Master Foo and said: “I am confused. Is it not the Unix way that every program should concentrate on one thing and do it well?” Master Foo nodded. The novice continued: “Isn't it also the Unix way that the wheel should not be reinvented?” Master Foo nodded again. “Why, then, are there several tools with similar capabilities in text processing: sed, awk and Perl? With which one can I best practic…

[deleted]
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