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The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

nytimes.com

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Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#481

Post by ben_w »

jmcphers wrote: post #208
kevincrane wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Proponents of efforts to make roads safer for cyclists have always gotten pushback from people who think that cycling is a niche hobby of rich lycra-clad yuppies. Which I think is misguided pushback btw (which I think you agree with based on the context). I see it as a chicken and egg thing. The roads are unsafe for bikers, so the only people who bike are those who are super dedicated to it. Then when people ask fo…

> It’s super unfortunate that it still gets the stereotype as a “rich white people” activity when it’s really so much more financially accessible than a car. It's true that a bicycle is itself cheaper than a car, but housing within biking distance to job centers sure isn't. In my view this is the primary reason bicycle commuters are stereotypically rich folks. The bicycle itself isn't the expensive part; you need pro…

> but housing within biking distance to job centers sure isn't. In my view this is the primary reason bicycle commuters are stereotypically rich folks.

Perhaps in some places (where the major newspapers are?), but there area I grew up in has residential, industrial, and commercial all mixed up in a way that solves that issue: https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=13/50.8285/-1.0276

(Likewise Berlin, though Berlin also has much better public transport).

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#482

Post by howenterprisey »

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #441
mcny wrote: post #434

Earlier quoted context omitted.

» What it took was a focus on good quality bike lanes outside the affluent white neighborhoods, bike accessibility at transit stations/on busses, and expansion of bikeshare to poorer neighborhoods. I've never been to Chattanooga, TN but once I realized I can work from home I've been curious about owning a home somewhere with gigabit fiber but without ridiculously expensive real estate within commuting distance to a C…

TN is a tax haven state. You're not going to get polished municipal services and infrastructure. Western New York has cheap housing and older, 150+ year old urbanization that doesn't suffer as much from 20th century shortsightedness.

What are some other tax haven states I should know about?

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#483

Post by dTal »

Scroedingershat wrote: post #388
dTal wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

E-scooters might be a way in. They're not as fast or as safe (to the rider), but they're practical in way e-bikes aren't due to portability. You can carry one into the office and charge it under your desk. And they lack the cultural baggage of cycling. And it's possible to look suave on one in a way that bicycles make difficult.

They're horrifically expensive, but something like an electric brompton as most of those same advantages. You can also usually take them on a bus or train. I'd disagree on the looking suave bit, it might just be because so many riders are clueless (and this perception being reenforced by selection bias), but someone on an escooter always looks far sillier to me than someone on a dutch style or folding bike, or even s…

It's a little rich to criticise on grounds of cost and then suggest an electric brompton in the same breath - they're nearly 10 times as expensive as the cheapest bikes/e-scooters. You can spend that much on an e-scooter, but you don't need to. E-scooters are about as affordable as bicycles.

Regarding lycra - we can disagree on whether you look suave while riding, but a huge advantage of the e-scooter is that you don't need special clothing - don't even need to tuck your pants leg into your sock. You wouldn't turn up to a date clad in lycra - but you can ride an e-scooter to one.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#484

Post by Gareth321 »

nradov wrote: post #107
enriquto wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mixed-use paths are an extremely bad idea and dangerous for everybody. I actively avoid them as a pedestrian and as a cyclist. They should all disappear. If ebikes help to accelerate the inevitable dismissal of these stupid mixed-use lanes, so good! A bike-friendly infrastructure is based on three separate networks, for pedestrians, cycles and cars. Each of the three networks must be continuous, reasonably complete a…

That's a nice ideal but it's just not realistic in most existing built up areas. There's literally not enough space for three separate networks without knocking down existing buildings and buying a lot of land through eminent domain. Let's focus on what can actually be achieved with realistic levels of funding.

I encourage you to watch [this video.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XuBdf9jYj7o) No one believed they had enough space in the Netherlands either. Turns out they did, with some creative engineering, time, money, and sheer force of will. It's not easy. It takes a long time. But with a steady hand and the ability to cut through lobby interests, it can be done. Note that they didn't need to knock down many buildings in the NL. They did things like reducing 3-4 lanes to 2; making roads and footpaths narrower; reclaiming roads and re-routing vehicle traffic elsewhere; and of course better utilising a lot of wasted curbside land. Plus lots of redrawing of city plans to ensure future building and renovations incorporated the vision.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#485

Post by bluecalm »

I am very excited about e-bikes although I don't own one yet. We need more people pushing for infrastructure and regulation changes. The biggest obstacle I see to mass adoption is bike theft problem. Until the crime is taken very seriously by the police which will likely need aggressive policing, setting traps and putting thieves in jail for many years (the police officer told me most thefts are committed by people already caught before) you will always live in fear of waking up in the morning to your main mean of transportation being gone unable to fulfill your professional/personal commitments.

Until that starts changing I don't think there will be many takers for an e-bikes unless you already own a car.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#486

Post by CalRobert »

forgotmyoldname wrote: post #244
Maarten88 wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd suggest starting with bike paths to schools. Kids don't have the problems you mention, they also don't have an alternative when they want to travel independently.

A lot of Americans are morbidly afraid of their children being away from adult supervision for more than a minute. I think suggesting 10 year olds ride a bike instead of taking a car or bus might infuriate more than a few people.

Well, it's scary, perhaps because drivers are the most likely people to kill your kid. But all the same I was very fortunate to have parents that let me roam free and explore from a young age.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#487

Post by louhike »

_se wrote: post #270
fnord77 wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

5 miles is quite a distance for a bike commute. I've done about this distance for a while and I won't go back to doing it. Interestingly, the average distance the Dutch ride is about 1.2 miles per day: https://www.peopleforbikes.org/news/best-kept-secret-dutch-b...

5 miles is a very easy bike commute, not sure what you're talking about. It's about 20 minutes each way.

It depends on where you ride. My commute is 5 miles, and it takes 30 minutes, even though I'm used to bike, because of the circulation, all the time I have to stop.

I agree it's easy if you're fit though. But I know it can be a pain for people who don't do sport at least weekly.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#488

Post by cjrp »

chrisseaton wrote: post #309
mjmahone17 wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Housing within bicycle commuting distance (under 5 miles) in many cities is abundant, if you’re willing to forgo a car. Especially if you convert the car savings to rent or mortgage payments. Basically, if you can be all-in on not driving, you save a lot. But once you even want to drive a little bit, the savings to driving only sometimes instead of all the time is not very large (and can in fact be negative, as you p…

> Housing within bicycle commuting distance (under 5 miles) in many cities is abundant Housing isn’t abundant within 50 miles of London and other similar major cities, let alone 5.

It's true, but with a folding bike your criteria for a house can now be "fewer than 5 miles away from a tube/train line" and let the public transport do the heavy lifting.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#489

Post by namdnay »

bink wrote: post #91
TrevorJ wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It cuts both ways. I am lucky enough to live in an area with an EXTENSIVE system of mixed-use trails for bikes and pedestrians. I worry that e-bikes, which are potentially much less pedestrian-friendly, will lead to a pushback against bikes being used on these trials at all.

We're in a weird situation now where I think most people riding e-bikes are doing so illegally on trails and paths. It's not being enforced yet where I live and I fear the push-back when someone inevitably gets hurt.

> are doing so illegally on trails and paths

don't you have restricted ebikes in the US? In most of Europe they're either sold restricted to 25kmh, in which case they're legally bikes, or unrestricted, in which case they're legally mopeds

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#490

Post by joshuaissac »

tomcooks wrote: post #414
notlion wrote: post #327

Earlier quoted context omitted.

30mph is often needed to keep up with cars in areas where the bike infrastructure is poor or nonexistent. If you can't maintain the speed of traffic, cars will try to pass creating a more dangerous situation for the ebike rider.

I fail to find the connection between speed and safety, especially from a completely unshielded pilot point of view. It's not a bike's job to maintain safety and traffic speed, but the opposite.

> It's not a bike's job to maintain safety and traffic speed, but the opposite.

It does not matter whose job it is. If increasing speed improves safety for the cyclist, in this case by reducing the incentive for car drivers to overtake, then a good number of cyclists will do it.

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