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The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

nytimes.com

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Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#291

Post by ClumsyPilot »

TrevorJ wrote: post #253
jdavis703 wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Riding a motorcycle is easier than a bike. In a motorcycle there’s three evasive actions: brake, accelerate or swerve. On a bicycle there’s only two, and that lack of speed is exactly what causes some of the riskiest behaviors from motorists (e.g. close passing.)

I think it's charitable to say there are even two fully useful evasive actions on a bike. An absolutely tiny contact patch and low weight mean that there's simply not enough traction for any sort of aggressive change in direction or speed without ending up off the bike. What's pernicious about this is, that under normal circumstances most people won't have ridden a bike past these limits, maybe ever, so the first tim…

"the first time you realize your bike can go from well behaved to on the pavement instantly is the worst time for it to happen."

I am always afraid of falling of the bike while there is a bus driving behind me. Could happed with a pothole, random garbage/bottle of the road, etv

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#292

Post by Retric »

gsinclair wrote: post #180
kevincrane wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Proponents of efforts to make roads safer for cyclists have always gotten pushback from people who think that cycling is a niche hobby of rich lycra-clad yuppies. Which I think is misguided pushback btw (which I think you agree with based on the context). I see it as a chicken and egg thing. The roads are unsafe for bikers, so the only people who bike are those who are super dedicated to it. Then when people ask fo…

> Edit: to add on, bikes are like 1-2 orders of magnitude cheaper than cars too, both in upfront and ongoing costs also. It’s super unfortunate that it still gets the stereotype as a “rich white people” activity when it’s really so much more financially accessible than a car. Here’s a theory: road cycling is more available to those who live reasonably close to work and have time to spare, and that is relatively rich…

The real difference is people working 9-5 see other commuters working 9-5 where students, working class, and poor people have a much wider range of schedules.

As to living near the urban core, inner cities have a lot of relatively poor people. Roommates and HUD style affordable housing add another dimension to housing that’s not obvious to most people. Twenty to Thirty percent of the units have been set aside for low or middle-income residents, which means the monthly rent is affordable to low or middle-income households and those households must qualify at the outset. https://www.residenewyork.com/faq/how-many-units-are-allocat...

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#293

Post by wolverine876 »

rdtwo wrote: post #250
gsinclair wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Edit: to add on, bikes are like 1-2 orders of magnitude cheaper than cars too, both in upfront and ongoing costs also. It’s super unfortunate that it still gets the stereotype as a “rich white people” activity when it’s really so much more financially accessible than a car. Here’s a theory: road cycling is more available to those who live reasonably close to work and have time to spare, and that is relatively rich…

That and they often work at night when it’s extremely unsafe to bike

> night when it’s extremely unsafe to bike

Not necessarily. There is often less traffic at night, for example. It depends on how well-lit the route is.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#294

Post by RandallBrown »

mulmen wrote: post #263
danny_codes wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As long as they're speed-limited to conventional biking speed I don't think this is much of a problem. E-bikes have similar mass to normal bikes so the forces are basically the same.

They aren't limited to conventional biking speed. The rental bikes are close but they're still significantly faster than any human-powered vehicle on the bike path. A buddy of mine bought a Super73 which has speed limiting modes but operates purely on the honor system. In the "unlimited" mode it can do 28mph, without pedaling. In the "limited" mode it can still do 20, which is faster than most people are capable of f…

A friend of mine also has a Super73 and it's basically an electric motorcycle.

I've passed people on Lime/Jump bikes while riding a single speed bike so I'm not sure that I'd say they're significantly faster. They can get up to speed much faster than a regular bike, which is really nice in traffic.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#295

Post by ClumsyPilot »

nradov wrote: post #118
jacquesm wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That depends on the conditions. If you adapt to the conditions then that would be fine, if you don't then even at normal e-bike speeds you are a danger. I never got why we have 200 Mph cars but a moped that can go 30 over the legal limit gets confiscated.

Only a tiny handful of expensive sports cars can actually reach 200 mph. While there a few limited exceptions, in most jurisdictions anyone caught driving at 200 mph will be arrested and the car impounded.

In this context 200 or 150 mph are the same: illegal, and instant death if anything goes wrong.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#296

Post by wolverine876 »

sbierwagen wrote: post #167
paulgb wrote: post #4

The thing that excites me most about e-bikes is that they change the politics around cycling. Proponents of efforts to make roads safer for cyclists have always gotten pushback from people who think that cycling is a niche hobby of rich lycra-clad yuppies. With e-bikes becoming more common, I know a number of people who would not have touched a bike share but are using it as a replacement for Uber/Lyft rides. People…

>from people who think that cycling is a niche hobby of rich lycra-clad yuppies This has never been true, of course. As you would expect for something that costs a hundredth as much as a car, bicycling to work has always been more common among the poor: https://usa.streetsblog.org/2014/05/08/low-income-americans-...

That has not been my observation, except for kids and people delivering food.

Consider there may be a dignity issue: If you are a lycra-clad yuppy, you're cycling because you want to. If you're poor, it looks like you can't afford a car.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#297

Post by jdavis703 »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #291
TrevorJ wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's charitable to say there are even two fully useful evasive actions on a bike. An absolutely tiny contact patch and low weight mean that there's simply not enough traction for any sort of aggressive change in direction or speed without ending up off the bike. What's pernicious about this is, that under normal circumstances most people won't have ridden a bike past these limits, maybe ever, so the first tim…

"the first time you realize your bike can go from well behaved to on the pavement instantly is the worst time for it to happen." I am always afraid of falling of the bike while there is a bus driving behind me. Could happed with a pothole, random garbage/bottle of the road, etv

If you’re an urban cyclist find a safe place like a parking lot to practice sudden braking, tight turns, etc. And if there’s a suitable spot practice riding on gravel too… Should roughly simulate loosing grip on rough roads.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#298

Post by wolverine876 »

What is the solution for weather? Major cities in the US can regularly be in the 30s F (~0-5 C) in the winter. Add to that a nice 10-15 mph wind in your face from riding. And especially add snow and ice - or worse, rain or freezing rain - and I don't see many people wanting to rely on an e-bike for unavoidable trips.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#299

Post by jodrellblank »

TulliusCicero wrote: post #80
parineum wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're not going to get any push back from me that bike lanes aren't plentiful or especially safe. The push back you get from me is that "the streets are dangerous" isn't an excuse to make sidewalks dangerous.

Being a pedestrian around cyclists is dangerous, but not as dangerous as being a cyclist around cars. So I find it hard to fault cyclists who go onto the sidewalk.

In the UK it's illegal to bike on the pavement. [1] says "Rule 64. You MUST NOT cycle on a pavement. Laws HA 1835 sect 72 & R(S)A sect 129" (exception: combined bike lanes and pavement, if the cyclist stays in the bike section).

Saying "the way things are is dangerous for me, so I'm going to break the law and be a danger to others instead because I'm what matters here" is not ok behaviour. If cycling is too dangerous for you, don't cycle. You don't get to say "driving in traffic is dangerous so I'm going to drive in the bus lane where there's less traffic", right?

[1] https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/rules-for-cycli...

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#300

Post by [deleted] »

nradov wrote: post #290
jmcphers wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It’s super unfortunate that it still gets the stereotype as a “rich white people” activity when it’s really so much more financially accessible than a car. It's true that a bicycle is itself cheaper than a car, but housing within biking distance to job centers sure isn't. In my view this is the primary reason bicycle commuters are stereotypically rich folks. The bicycle itself isn't the expensive part; you need pro…

In urban areas I see a lot of the lowest income restaurant workers commuting by bike. Those people often live fairly close to work, but are in some kind of precarious semi-legal housing situation or actually homeless. Most aren't citizens and are basically invisible to politicians and urban planners. For example check out the restaurants in Mountain View, CA patronized by affluent employees of Google and LinkedIn. Wa…

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