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Blind people won the right to break eBook DRM, but they'll have to do it again

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Re: Blind people won the right to break eBook DRM, but they'll have to do it again

#61

Post by sbst32 »

salamandersauce wrote: post #57
criddell wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stuff like drop caps, kerning that isn't terrible, hyphenation, and better word spacing. None of it matters if you are feeding the text to a speech synthesizer, but it can make a difference when reading.

Some of that stuff you can get back by using an ePub version and reader from the AZW3 file which can typically be done using KindleUnpack. Some of it is less the file format and more the rendering engine used and they simply haven't bothered to backport it to their AZW3 renderers. Amazon does AFAIK precompute some stuff like hyphenation but not everything.

The point is the KFX format does have all that natively.

Re: Blind people won the right to break eBook DRM, but they'll have to do it again

#62

Post by dv_dt »

patrec wrote: post #53
dv_dt wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For books the analog hole is probably widening with better ocr now than ever.

The last remaining analog hole may soon be people. Recording devices are basically already digital, and there is no fundamental difficulty in embedding enough pattern recognition to ensures that you don't replicate material that's either thoughtcrime or the valuable IP of Elsevier, RIAA or some similar benefactor of humanity. Photoshop reportedly already refuses to work on scenes that contain money.

Money is one thing, but you can’t exactly autoblur all text without a mass uproar. And at least for now I don’t think it’s feasible to keep enough updated storage and processing around photo devices to recognize temporary pics of all copyrighted texts either - even with heavily optimized hashes. But, I could be wrong in this assumption.

Re: Blind people won the right to break eBook DRM, but they'll have to do it again

#63

Post by salamandersauce »

sbst32 wrote: post #61
salamandersauce wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of that stuff you can get back by using an ePub version and reader from the AZW3 file which can typically be done using KindleUnpack. Some of it is less the file format and more the rendering engine used and they simply haven't bothered to backport it to their AZW3 renderers. Amazon does AFAIK precompute some stuff like hyphenation but not everything.

The point is the KFX format does have all that natively.

And my point is that some of it not native (it's handled by the renderer) and it's possible to get back or similar enough (precomputing hyphenation).

Re: Blind people won the right to break eBook DRM, but they'll have to do it again

#64

Post by unhammer »

sohkamyung wrote: post #9
JakeWesorick wrote: post #3

Where can I get these DRM free eBooks?

Libreture maintains a list of DRM free stores [1]. [1] https://www.libreture.com/bookshops/

That's a good list. I've found some stuff I was looking for at Bloomsbury. Tor is probably good if you're into sci-fi/fantasy. But if you're looking for a specific book in English it's typically very hard to find a place to pay for a DRM-free e-book.

A search engine that covers all the little sites selling DRM-free books would be nice!

(Publishers of Norwegian books fortunately tend to have just do watermarks, which is fine – you can read the book on whatever device you want, and your copy has a little note saying "ex libris Your Name" or something)

Re: Blind people won the right to break eBook DRM, but they'll have to do it again

#65

Post by helloworld11 »

hkt wrote: post #22
helloworld11 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Libgen is great for older literature and non-fiction books of all kinds, but for modern fiction it sucks.

Really? What have you struggled to find? I've found libgen enormously helpful.

Maybe it's just my pop fiction preferences but if I search for any sort of modern horror or sci fi fiction, I just can't seem to find any content. Pirate bay on the other hand? No problem. Like I said though, almost any modern non fiction and a great deal of older fiction literature is definitely there, so I'm definitely not criticizing libgen. It's mostly wonderful, though one worries about malware luring in downloads, but on this maybe im just being paranoid.

Re: Blind people won the right to break eBook DRM, but they'll have to do it again

#66

Post by criddell »

salamandersauce wrote: post #63
sbst32 wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point is the KFX format does have all that natively.

And my point is that some of it not native (it's handled by the renderer) and it's possible to get back or similar enough (precomputing hyphenation).

If you're willing to do a bunch of work, you may be able to recreate something close to the original KFX. AFAIK you won't get kerning though. That seems to be tied to the renderer used for KFX files.

The other part is that there isn't a single definitive KFX file for a title. If you have an Oasis and I have a Paperwhite and we both download the same book, I believe we get different KFX files. There's no reason to doubt that there will be future Kindle devices that are even better with respect to typography and so you will need to re-download your library for that device.

Today, KFX can sometimes be De-DRM'd but it's gotten to the point where it's a cat and mouse game. It works for a while then Amazon changes something and breaks it. I don't doubt that essentially uncrackable DRM is achievable.

The real fix is legislative.

Re: Blind people won the right to break eBook DRM, but they'll have to do it again

#67

Post by helloworld11 »

patrec wrote: post #23
helloworld11 wrote: post #17

Fuck having to ask for the "right". If they bought their digital books, they should absolutely be free to do whatever they like with them for personal usability. I can understand the legal rights position here, revolving around bringing attention to the issue of these idiotic rules, but if I buy ebooks, i'll just go ahead and strip their DRM without giving a damn who says no. The absurdity of DRM laws is really made…

> but if I buy ebooks, i'll just go ahead and strip their DRM without giving a damn who says no Yeah, dream on. How long do you think this option will stay available to you? I sometimes get the impression that intelligent technical people on HN can't see ahead 5 minutes into the future, because being a peon without rights is something that conflicts with their self image as some technical sophisticate not subject to…

Well, I can't predict the future, but so far I've managed to bypass every bullshit DRM control I've come across for text content and ebooks without too much trouble. It's mainly a question of choosing your mediums and hardware a bit more selectively. This doesn't make me blind to anything beyond the next 5 minutes and personally, i'm far from a technical person. Yes, the tech and media giants will keep looking for ways for screw people into becoming captive consumers who "buy" things that they don't even really own, but technology has so far done a remarkably good job of counteracting much of these attempts if one bothers to use it with a bit of creativity.

edit: clarity

Re: Blind people won the right to break eBook DRM, but they'll have to do it again

#68

Post by gizmo686 »

ptudan wrote: post #50
cabalamat wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Breaking DRM for personal use should not and cannot be illegal Agreed, including fro other people's personal use. Companies should be allowed to protect data by copyright or DRM, but not both, i.e. encasing something in DRM would remove its copyright.

I don't really track this argument. DRM generally exists to make it easier to protect copyright, no? They go hand in hand.

Think about patents. If you get a patent, you are legally protected from people stealing your patented idea for the lifetime of the patent. However, in exchange for that protection, you must make the idea public. In exchange for the protection of law, a patent holder sacrifices the protection of secrecy.

A simmiliar model could be applied to copyright, in exchange for legal protections, you must forgo technical protections.

Re: Blind people won the right to break eBook DRM, but they'll have to do it again

#69

Post by zozbot234 »

bryanrasmussen wrote: post #12
werkjohann wrote: post #7

This is terrible, and while IANAL I’m confused why it doesn’t fall under ADA requirements to provide accessible versions of materials - especially school materials. Also, can people really claim with a straight face that running a book through text-to-speech is the same as a real audiobook (that’s often a voice actor, right?)?

for books popular enough to get that treatment sure, I used to do volunteer reading to make audiobooks but had to quit when someone handed me the most pseudoscientific rubbish to read - it really felt like taking advantage - some book selling a lifestyle advice thing that would lead to immortality!!

LibriVox is a well-known project in this space that by and large focuses on worthwhile stuff, not pseudoscientific rubbish.

Re: Blind people won the right to break eBook DRM, but they'll have to do it again

#70

Post by sohkamyung »

unhammer wrote: post #64
sohkamyung wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Libreture maintains a list of DRM free stores [1]. [1] https://www.libreture.com/bookshops/

That's a good list. I've found some stuff I was looking for at Bloomsbury. Tor is probably good if you're into sci-fi/fantasy. But if you're looking for a specific book in English it's typically very hard to find a place to pay for a DRM-free e-book. A search engine that covers all the little sites selling DRM-free books would be nice! (Publishers of Norwegian books fortunately tend to have just do watermarks, which…

Kobo [1] and Google Play Books [2] also sells some books DRM free. You have to check the book details to see if it says 'DRM free'.

[1] https://www.kobo.com/ [2] https://play.google.com/store/books

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