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Denuvo-Protected Games Rendered Unplayable After Domain Expires

torrentfreak.com

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Re: Denuvo-Protected Games Rendered Unplayable After Domain Expires

#31

Post by the_mitsuhiko »

kayson wrote: post #12

Has anyone ever done an a analysis on whether Denuvo (or DRM in general) is actually a wise investment of capital? I imagine it probably does have some impact on early sales in that it will prevent early customers from pirating to try it rather than buying it. But at the same time, you have things like Steam's return policy, the general dislike of DRM, and the publicity/image cost when something happens preventing ev…

I did not do the analysis myself but I saw some numbers and they make it a very good investment. Unfortunately I cannot share.

Re: Denuvo-Protected Games Rendered Unplayable After Domain Expires

#32

Post by dmix »

WmyEE0UsWAwC2i wrote: post #25

DRM doesn't work in games, go to a torrent site to see all the failed attempts. 1. It costs money 2. It makes the product worse(slower, less portable,etc...) for your _ paying _ customers. 3. It doesn't work if the game is good. Just add a copyright note on the corner and make sure to have good distribution.

As others have mentioned it’s probably only helpful on release date or the first weeks.

Ideally it should just automatically expired after x amount of time.

Re: Denuvo-Protected Games Rendered Unplayable After Domain Expires

#33

Post by skyeto »

Mindwipe wrote: post #11
skyeto wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't that depend on local laws? My assumption is that it would be covered by the recent EU court ruling that allows reverse engineering to fix bugs[0]. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28809559

It definitely would not be because that ruling does not overrule other bits of legislation, such as the prohibition against distribution or importation of tools to circumvent technical protection measure that all EU countries have.

The parent comments were talking about applying a crack to a legitimately obtained copy (which I assume the case covers) and not the act of distributing a cracked copy (which it definitely doesn't cover).

Re: Denuvo-Protected Games Rendered Unplayable After Domain Expires

#34

Post by novok »

dageshi wrote: post #24
kayson wrote: post #12

Has anyone ever done an a analysis on whether Denuvo (or DRM in general) is actually a wise investment of capital? I imagine it probably does have some impact on early sales in that it will prevent early customers from pirating to try it rather than buying it. But at the same time, you have things like Steam's return policy, the general dislike of DRM, and the publicity/image cost when something happens preventing ev…

It's really only to protect the launch window. Most games will be discounted later on to the point where they're more or less affordable to everyone. But if someone pirates on release they'll never be inclined to buy at that lower price later on.

This is the reason why I've mostly heard. TBH it would probably be a good ideas for vendors to remove DRM after a game has been out for a few years and has stopped getting patches for a year+.

Re: Denuvo-Protected Games Rendered Unplayable After Domain Expires

#35

Post by shmde »

GuB-42 wrote: post #26
kayson wrote: post #12

Has anyone ever done an a analysis on whether Denuvo (or DRM in general) is actually a wise investment of capital? I imagine it probably does have some impact on early sales in that it will prevent early customers from pirating to try it rather than buying it. But at the same time, you have things like Steam's return policy, the general dislike of DRM, and the publicity/image cost when something happens preventing ev…

Well used, Denuvo is not that bad. It is misuse that cause games to become slow or unplayable. And generally, it only serves to protect the first few months of sales, it is not uncommon to strip out DRM after that. Indie games often don't need it (and don't do it). AAA games are a different story. Including DRM is a significant expense in a low budget game, these games are usually cheaper, and people are often more s…

> Well used, Denuvo is not that bad.

Ubisoft admitting that Denuvo ( idk why they used the term third party lol ) causes PC stuttering.

https://gamerant.com/ubisoft-third-party-software-pc-stutter...

Resident evil 8 runs better when it is stripped off its denuvo protection. As confirmed by Digital foundry's video.

https://youtu.be/UXZGCwAJpbM

https://www.pcgamer.com/resident-evil-village-drm-denuvo-stu...

You will now see a huge influx of video games being stripped of denuvo because it literally shits itself in 12th gen Intel chips and games become unplayable with denuvo.

> And generally, it only serves to protect the first few months of sales, it is not uncommon to strip out DRM after that.

Nope, disagree. The only time they strip Denuvo out is when the game is cracked by warez scenes or if the cost of paying denuvo gets bigger than the people actually paying for it.

Some video games which are out for well over an year but just got denuvo removed in the last 2-3 months out of the blue. It is because of denuvos incompatibility with win11.

1.Shadow of Tomb Raider (3 years)

2.Rise of tomb raider (6 years )

3.Injustice 2 (4years)

4.Jedi fallen order (2years )

5.Nier replicant.

6. Tekken 7 (6years).

> AAA games rely on advertising for that and run close to market saturation so pirate copies are more of an opportunity cost.

Trust me when I say people who pirate are usually the ones who never ever buy video games. Pirates can never be considered an opportunity cost. Not trying to glorify pirates, but people waited patiently for over an year to play RDR2 till it got cracked, so that they don't have to pay outta their pockets.

Re: Denuvo-Protected Games Rendered Unplayable After Domain Expires

#36

Post by Izkata »

kayson wrote: post #12

Has anyone ever done an a analysis on whether Denuvo (or DRM in general) is actually a wise investment of capital? I imagine it probably does have some impact on early sales in that it will prevent early customers from pirating to try it rather than buying it. But at the same time, you have things like Steam's return policy, the general dislike of DRM, and the publicity/image cost when something happens preventing ev…

This is just one point, but I started pirating games during college because of DRM, after whatever they used in Spore destroyed Windows so badly I had to do a full reinstall and lost a bunch of stuff. Before that I reliably bought all my games.

I don't pirate games anymore, but that's only because I stopped playing computer games entirely and stick to consoles, to avoid DRM screwing with my stuff.

Re: Denuvo-Protected Games Rendered Unplayable After Domain Expires

#37

Post by bluesign »

shmde wrote: post #35
GuB-42 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well used, Denuvo is not that bad. It is misuse that cause games to become slow or unplayable. And generally, it only serves to protect the first few months of sales, it is not uncommon to strip out DRM after that. Indie games often don't need it (and don't do it). AAA games are a different story. Including DRM is a significant expense in a low budget game, these games are usually cheaper, and people are often more s…

> Well used, Denuvo is not that bad. Ubisoft admitting that Denuvo ( idk why they used the term third party lol ) causes PC stuttering. https://gamerant.com/ubisoft-third-party-software-pc-stutter... Resident evil 8 runs better when it is stripped off its denuvo protection. As confirmed by Digital foundry's video. https://youtu.be/UXZGCwAJpbM https://www.pcgamer.com/resident-evil-village-drm-denuvo-stu... You will no…

> Trust me when I say people who pirate are usually the ones who never ever buy video games.

It is not like black and white. There are a lot of people in between pirate and pre-order player.

Re: Denuvo-Protected Games Rendered Unplayable After Domain Expires

#38

Post by shmde »

dageshi wrote: post #24
kayson wrote: post #12

Has anyone ever done an a analysis on whether Denuvo (or DRM in general) is actually a wise investment of capital? I imagine it probably does have some impact on early sales in that it will prevent early customers from pirating to try it rather than buying it. But at the same time, you have things like Steam's return policy, the general dislike of DRM, and the publicity/image cost when something happens preventing ev…

It's really only to protect the launch window. Most games will be discounted later on to the point where they're more or less affordable to everyone. But if someone pirates on release they'll never be inclined to buy at that lower price later on.

> But if someone pirates on release they'll never be inclined to buy at that lower price later on.

Just a personal anecdote. I have pirated a shitton amount of video games when I was young and didn't have money. You know what was one of the first thing I did after getting my salary ? I bought burnout paradise. I now own almost 1/2 of all the video games which I played as a pirate on steam and epic.

And also people who generally take the pirate route to play video games, never ever generally pay for it. So expecting a pirate would give in to buy a video game which he thinks will definitely get cracked in the near future is not really a good idea.

Re: Denuvo-Protected Games Rendered Unplayable After Domain Expires

#39

Post by lostcolony »

bluesign wrote: post #37
shmde wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Well used, Denuvo is not that bad. Ubisoft admitting that Denuvo ( idk why they used the term third party lol ) causes PC stuttering. https://gamerant.com/ubisoft-third-party-software-pc-stutter... Resident evil 8 runs better when it is stripped off its denuvo protection. As confirmed by Digital foundry's video. https://youtu.be/UXZGCwAJpbM https://www.pcgamer.com/resident-evil-village-drm-denuvo-stu... You will no…

> Trust me when I say people who pirate are usually the ones who never ever buy video games. It is not like black and white. There are a lot of people in between pirate and pre-order player.

I mean, "never ever" is extreme. But the point is "does leaving a game easy to pirate, vs making it hard to pirate, actually decrease sales".

And unfortunately it's kind of impossible to test that.

Re: Denuvo-Protected Games Rendered Unplayable After Domain Expires

#40

Post by Spivak »

harha wrote: post #9
krageon wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't own the game, you own a license to play it for however long the publisher wants. Whether or not it is legal really shouldn't matter, it should just be done as a matter of course for such games.

(Not a lawyer) You could probably sue in some jurisdictions, since a main aspect of the contract was not clearly advertised. If it has a buy button for game xyz you should assume you’re buying the game, not a license, even if the fine print says otherwise. For multiplayer games it would probably be ok to not perpetually run the servers, for single player the server isn’t an aspect that is crucial to the functioning.…

These kinds of arguments don't make any sense to me. You can't buy copyrighted works[1], only licenses to them. So Steam changes the button to "Buy License" and literally nothing changes. Are you happy now? Of course not. Because that's not the issue. The thing you have issue with is the terms of the license, not the license itself.

[1] Okay fine you can but nobody who buys Skyrim thinks they are buying the rights to the whole Skyrim media property. But hey, I hope I'm wrong and you all owe me lots of royalties.

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