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Spiders are much smarter than you think

knowablemagazine.org

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Re: Spiders are much smarter than you think

#201

Post by shostack »

Klaster_1 wrote: post #4

Talking about Portias, I recommend reading "Children of Time" by Adrian Tchaikovsky, it's about the process of uplifting spiders and how humans re-establish contacts with them. Another great book about smart "spiders" is "A Deepness in the Sky" by Vernor Vinge, my favorite in the "Zones of Thought" series.

One of my favorite sci-fi books of all time. What makes it so good is how the author manages to get you to see the world through the (many) eyes of the Portia spider, and evolve it they get uplifted.

The use of ants is pure genius.

The sequel, Children of Ruin, is likewise compelling, but lacks some of the finesse and mystique of the first book.

Re: Spiders are much smarter than you think

#202

Post by LurkingPenguin »

lux wrote: post #85
bryans wrote: post #18

A couple years ago I had an experience with a spider that entirely changed my perspective on them and most insects, and now I make a conscious effort to help them as much as possible, instead of kill or even repel them. This particular spider kept running back and forth between my monitor and a window, and when it'd get to my monitor, it would wave its front legs at me. If I moved to the left, it would run across to…

I had a similar experience with a spider who had made an egg sack in a precarious spot along our back door that was definitely in hazard's way. I got a stick and a leaf and tried to detach and move her setup to a nearby spot that would be safer. She did not like that. At one point in the move, she got left behind and I ended up with just the egg sack to move. You could feel the panic and protective instinct in her mo…

> You could feel the panic and protective instinct in her movements.

This comment reminded me of a great book I read called Mama's Last Hug: Animal Emotions and What They Tell Us about Ourselves.

https://www.amazon.com/Mamas-Last-Hug-Animal-Emotions/dp/039...

Re: Spiders are much smarter than you think

#204

Post by wombatmobile »

It’s easy to be blind to the intelligence of animals that inhabit places we don’t go or think about.

Then one day, as so many accounts here attest, we notice a spider or an animal cross our realm and see that we have things in common - the urge to protect and nurture our young; the drive for self preservation; the call of hunger or thirst.

We do this not just with insects and animals, but also with other people. That ability to shut out the recognition of other people’s basic needs and feelings helps us to prioritise our own families welfare, and to get ahead personally.

That’s all understandable and ok to an extent. Taken too far, we risk alienating ourselves from something richly rewarding and powerfully good - the fellowship of people, insects and animals we haven’t met yet.

Re: Spiders are much smarter than you think

#205

Post by ignasl »

stoned wrote: post #93
bryans wrote: post #18

A couple years ago I had an experience with a spider that entirely changed my perspective on them and most insects, and now I make a conscious effort to help them as much as possible, instead of kill or even repel them. This particular spider kept running back and forth between my monitor and a window, and when it'd get to my monitor, it would wave its front legs at me. If I moved to the left, it would run across to…

There is a Russian (Eastern European? Slavic?) superstition against kill spiders. You can kill insects all day, but you don’t kill spiders. You just leave them be.

Yes, killing spiders is a bad omen in Lithuania. Usually they're simply thrown out. Not sure how many people does this nowadays but it stuck with me.

Re: Spiders are much smarter than you think

#206

Post by hoseja »

johnny53169 wrote: post #121
whatshisface wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a counterpoint, how could you possibly see panic on a spider's "face?"

We are all alive in the same way

That's not really a given. Maybe arguable for mammals, but arthropods? What about sponges? Fungi? Trees?

Re: Spiders are much smarter than you think

#207

Post by hoseja »

AwaAwa wrote: post #59
Levitz wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh please. Animals don't even have the empathy to outright kill a prey before eating it and will have it dismembered, bleeding out and alive no problem. Nature is beautiful but let's not pretend it's caring or loving. Cats play with their food. Spiders liquefy their preys, melting them from the inside out. Crabs eat their newborn offspring. Do any of these feel bad at all about it? No. Find me an animal who went vega…

Human industrial slaughter where animals are trussed up and dismembered and skinned while still conscious (granted due to failures in the stun mechanism, but there isn't much push to monitor assembly line failures) would beg to differ. Or how about male chicks being liquefied and fed back to the chickens? Add to that the kosher/halal slaughter. This idea that all humanity is 'above' base animal behavior is as ridicul…

Why put empathy on a pedestal, it's clearly only there to facilitate group cooperation, because group cooperation is advantageous.

Re: Spiders are much smarter than you think

#208

Post by IronHerald »

culi wrote: post #173
kevincox wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally I just closed the tab when the SUBSCRIBE TO OUR NEWSLETTER dialog obscured the article. I didn't expect to get much value from the content anyways so can't be bothered to deal with their crap.

uBlock Origin allows you to filter custom elements on webpages. I can zap those elements and next time I visit that site I won't have to put up with it. It's game-changing although I wish there was a way we could share custom filters with others so I don't have to do this for every site each time

Oh, but there is a way to "share custom filters with others" :) https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock/wiki/Filter-lists-from-aro...

There is also a cool site that aggregates custom lists and allows you to search for specific filter-lists and narrow down choices by using filters on top. You can then subscribe to them directly - most are hosted on github. Just keep in mind some of them haven't been updated in years - you can preview them, and check their last update - in most of cases anyway. https://filterlists.com/

BTW there are filters specifically designed to remove newsletter-signup messages, popups, popunders, as well as general "annoyances" :)

Re: Spiders are much smarter than you think

#209

Post by hosh »

hoseja wrote: post #206
johnny53169 wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are all alive in the same way

That's not really a given. Maybe arguable for mammals, but arthropods? What about sponges? Fungi? Trees?

Not OP. I think the brain is more a receiver of consciousness than a generator, and there are many types of receivers, beyond neural cells.

Trees will form a network with the cooperation of fungi, to exchange information and nutrients among each other. Plants will grow better when they are planted with companion plant, or cultivated in guilds (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guild_(ecology)

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