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Nuclear power is the best climate-change solution

wsj.com

231–240 of 354 posts

Re: Nuclear power is the best climate-change solution

#231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The ones that ensure with several 9's that the lights come on 24/7 regardless of time of day or weather. LCOE covers the generator alone, but not transmission lines, idled gas plants, energy storage, smart load balancing, etc. You can keep big gas plants around in a high intermittent grid and fire them up 10% of the time. The way we view LCOE right now, those plants would be insanely expensive while wind/solar would…

LCOE is just an investment tool to figure out where you get the most bang for your buck as an investor. It does not tell us what the best option is for the energy system as a whole.

I know. Yet it is being used to say what energy tech is cheapest.

Re: Nuclear power is the best climate-change solution

#232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

LCOE is just an investment tool to figure out where you get the most bang for your buck as an investor. It does not tell us what the best option is for the energy system as a whole.

I know. Yet it is being used to say what energy tech is cheapest.

The thing that bothers me about the whole energy discussion is that there seems to be little room for a middle ground, it's just a political discussion at this point. In reality we won't have 100% renewables and we won't have 100% nuclear either. Neither of those 2 options, at their extremes, is best from a cost perspective.

Re: Nuclear power is the best climate-change solution

#233

California is prematurely closing its perfectly good nuclear reactor: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diablo_Canyon_Power_Plant#Clos...

Thanks to the "Friends of the Earth" and "Natural Resources Defense Council" for pushing us to coal, natural gas, and blackouts... Also raising rates to pay for the premature decomissioning. ' https://www.wsj.com/articles/california-scrambles-to-find-el...

Your reliance on the far-right WSJ as a source for this makes me skeptical that this is solely the fault of environmental groups.

Re: Nuclear power is the best climate-change solution

#234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The moment people blame things on tree huggers https://www.encyclopedia.com/environment/educational-magazin... The late 1960s through 1980s saw a shift in the antinuclear movement toward protesting the development of nuclear power as an energy source. The antinuclear movement succeeded in virtually halting the governments' development of nuclear power.

How does one manage to stop nuclear energy but not fossil fuel use? These are arguably the same sorts of groups, with probably a large overlap. How did they have such power in one area, but not in another? If there is lack of lobbyist or industry pressure pushing for it, then we have to wonder why? Nuclear isn't cost effective as a business is the likely answer, and under our current system that drives most of the de…

They don't. But it benefits *for profit* energy companies to blame the lack of nuclear power on the hippies than on their ROI calculations. They can literally make money on wind power after 6 months, or they can spend billions of dollars and a decade on a nuclear plant that may never get finished. But it's the environmentalists that's stopping this development.

Re: Nuclear power is the best climate-change solution

#235
post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I don't understand from these groups is why they don't go after nuclear _after_ coal, natural gas, and oil are gone from the grid. There are arguments against nuclear, but they aren't that great when there are still fossil fuel plants operating. Also, a pet peeve of mine is when people say "replacing nuclear with zero-carbon sources" (as per the wiki article). That doesn't exist. There's energy sources that have…

There are no arguments against nuclear that stand up to scrutiny beyond emotional knee-jerk reactions. Nuclear is safe, cheap and most importantly reliable. Renewables are not reliable. Baseload renewables is a pipe dream that has been disproven repeatedly. Hence why jurisdictions that have dived into a heavy renewables energy mix are building gas peaking plants, utilising diesel generators in emergencies or adding b…

No arguments other than price and time to build. But most nuclear proponents will claim nuclear is perfectly safe, while simultaneously saying we should cut through the legislation and "red tape" in order to build it more cheaply. The very things which would make it safe in the first place.

Re: Nuclear power is the best climate-change solution

#236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it was, however this dates back 2014 and solar recycling is progressing, and becomes more and more legally mandatory in industrialized nations. Solar panels: operators now reach ~80% recycling (glass, metal, silicon, plastic). Wind turbines recycling is also quickly progressing.

Nuclear waste recycling is also progressing.

Many old industrial setups are now closed, and there are not many new projects.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_reprocessing#List_of_s...

Re: Nuclear power is the best climate-change solution

#237
post #7
post #6

We can't build reactors fast enough. And electricity is only a part of what generates emissions. It's no where close to a solution. Looking up the world's energy numbers, how much of total energy production and emissions are from electricity, how long it takes to build a nuclear power plant, how many nuclear power plants are built per year etc. will show you this.

China is gonna build 150 reactors in 15 years for 440 billion dollar. They lack the defeatist attitude common in the West and it shows.

CGN has exponentially increasing cost overruns and delays like the rest of 'em. It's just cheaper to have the cost overruns and delays because of their low cost of financing - which in turn is a big ol' chunk of the underlying problem behind the rash of state bank insolvencies that was the big news before the real estate insolvencies eclipsed them

Re: Nuclear power is the best climate-change solution

#238
Nukes might have been useful as a climate-change solution if they were not intimately, inextricably tied to massive, long-term (wholly legal) corruption. The bulk of the cost goes to corruption; but much worse is that they take many extra years to complete beyond what normal construction would take, because nobody actually involved wants that gravy train ever to dry up--anyway, not until after their kids graduate college--and deliver exactly zero watt-hours of energy, in the meantime, if indeed they are ever completed at all.

The latest failed US nuke project has cost ratepayers $30B already, is nowhere near done, and most likely never will be done.

Fortunately, solar and wind projects seem thus far immune to corruption. They often start delivering power immediately after they are begun, or anyway long before the project is done. They may easily be extended after they are "done", either on-site or somewhere entirely else.

Long before solar and wind produce enough power that we have reason to worry about "grid stability", storage solutions will be coming on-line, cheaply. Factories for iron-air batteries are being constructed at a frenzied pace, but they will compete with liquified air, ammonia, hydrogen, and other solutions according to local conditions. (Ammonia and hydrogen have the advantage that they are, also, feedstock for other processes.) In the meantime, the single best possible use for a renewable-energy dollar is more solar panel; later, storage will be a good investment.

Besides generating capacity, and storage, we will need a lot of long-distance high-voltage transmission lines, and ships to carry liquified ammonia to burn at higher latitudes where solar is not practical, and where relying just on long transmission lines is too risky.

Re: Nuclear power is the best climate-change solution

#239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does one manage to stop nuclear energy but not fossil fuel use? These are arguably the same sorts of groups, with probably a large overlap. How did they have such power in one area, but not in another? If there is lack of lobbyist or industry pressure pushing for it, then we have to wonder why? Nuclear isn't cost effective as a business is the likely answer, and under our current system that drives most of the de…

I think people freak out much more easily when imagining a Hiroshima or Chernobyl or Fukushima in their home towns than when trying to picture the slow but unrelenting worsening of climate conditions over time caused by fossil burning, even though the former is local and unlikely and the latter is global and certain.

One of the issues I've found is that people genuinely believe nuclear reactors run on the same tech as nuclear weapons, and think that if something goes wrong they will have a mushroom cloud.

Re: Nuclear power is the best climate-change solution

#240
post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Correlation is not causation

??? we're talking about the economic cost and carbon output of energy vs. how it is generated. Do you think there's some other common factor that explains France using lots of nuclear power and having a low carbon footprint and energy costs?

I think there are may be factors for Germany having high energy prices.
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