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Apple Silicon Macs can't boot from external drive if internal drive failed

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Re: Apple Silicon Macs can't boot from external drive if internal drive failed

#201

Post by CelestialTeapot »

bitwize wrote: post #199
webmobdev wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That's just reads like BS. Because it partly is. It's just a lame defence / justification of soldering SSD, RAM and other parts, the major advantage of which is to make modern electronics more complex, hard to repair and prevent upgrades (i.e. "planned obsolescence"). If SSDs were reliable beyond 5+ years, manufacturers would be highlighting that and even offering guarantees for such a period. (Hell, most RAM today…

Except soldering everything on can give you HUGE performance boosts. Like, laptops come with soldered-on RAM that you can't get in a DIMM configuration because the soldered on stuff is so fast it needs a fast path to the CPU, which DIMM slots can't provide. And now with Apple building all system RAM directly into the chip die, it's just a whole new ballgame. So you can either go modular and have a slow PC, or you can…

Sorry, what? Citation please. The speed lost moving a DIMM from a 3cm path-to-CPU to a removable DIMM slot 6cm away is infinitesimal. You would not notice it.

Re: Apple Silicon Macs can't boot from external drive if internal drive failed

#202

Post by StillBored »

donkeyd wrote: post #193
azalemeth wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is especially unlikely to be the underlying cause of unexpected and seemingly premature catastrophic SSD failure. One of my graduate students experienced this, the hard way: writing up his thesis, his mum plugged in "the wrong USB C" charger. I don't know exactly what happened, but the board was utterly fried. The problem with the soldered-to-the-motherboard, everything-utterly-encrypted approach is that it's al…

> soldered-to-the-motherboard, everything-utterly-encrypted approach is that it's almost impossible to do data recovery Well, that's kind of the point. > You just have to be damn sure that you back it up correctly. Exactly. And that's as easy as plugging in an external hard drive occasionally, or storing critical files in the cloud.

Back it up to some cloud vendor that also holds the encryption keys... Brilliant bit of security there...

/s

Re: Apple Silicon Macs can't boot from external drive if internal drive failed

#203

Post by rangoon626 »

sofixa wrote: post #144
1123581321 wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you are using old information. Any modern SSD should be good for a few hundred to several hundred TB and may reach a PB. It would be very hard to use a personal computer that heavily. Most people would take 20 years or more.

You're forgetting swap. Not to mention professionals in domains like photography, design, video, etc. who might chew through big files frequently.

Yes. Don't RAM-max at your own peril.

Re: Apple Silicon Macs can't boot from external drive if internal drive failed

#204

Post by kuschku »

mlindner wrote: post #85
Vogtinator wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not just about upgrades, in fact it's not even mainly about upgrades. It's about being able to understand the machine, repairing it when necessary and ultimately being able to rely on it. Otherwise your device might be a candidate for the bin after the warranty expired, which can be surprisingly quick.

This weird OCD obsession with wanting to be able to piece apart a device just like it's a car is just strange. The device is a complete package. You don't re-solder and reflash busted chips on a motherboard do you? So why do you want to be able to replace the higher level parts rather than the whole device? This isn't like a desktop where all the parts are bought from different manufacturers and assembled by an OEM o…

I bought a T470 used, replaced RAM, SSD, display, battery, and now I’ve got 16GB DDR4-3200 RAM, 2TB NVMe SSD, a 1080p 400 nits 105% sRGB display, and over 20h battery life in performance mode. For 460€.

I put some of the old parts together with some old desktop SSD in my old E540 and gave it my gf, who previously used an x220 with upgraded SSD and RAM. The E540 already has a new display, too.

I do replace and change and upgrade all these parts to be able to use a cheap laptop over many years, just like I do with a desktop.

Re: Apple Silicon Macs can't boot from external drive if internal drive failed

#205

Post by userbinator »

djrogers wrote: post #196
throw3849 wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

》The primary argument against soldering the SSD, or really any other part, down like this tends to be that "Oh, now you can't just save money by upgrading it yourself|replacing it when it breaks Are you trolling? The primary argument is data recovery. Anything on laptop can die: charging port, motherboard... With soldered ssd your data are gone! You need to resolder SSD into exact same machine type, it may take 5 wee…

Given that the encryption keys for the SSD are stored in the Secure Enclave, moving the SSD elsewhere wouldn't do you any good anyway.

...and that's the second problem they created.

Re: Apple Silicon Macs can't boot from external drive if internal drive failed

#206

Post by GordonS »

darrenf wrote: post #60
Milner08 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If only they were available in the UK

I'm in the UK too, finding myself unwilling to pay the new Mac prices and getting impatient for the framework. So, recently I've been considering a StarBook Mk V from https://starlabs.systems/ They publish a full disassembly guide[0], so I'm reasonably sure the whole thing is repairable and upgradable if necessary. Lots of options for custom build at order time including coreboot. I'm a bit hesitant about a 1920x1080…

I hadn't come across this laptop before, thanks for sharing!

It looks almost perfect, but only having a single USB-C port is a disappointing choice :(

Re: Apple Silicon Macs can't boot from external drive if internal drive failed

#207

Post by Chocola »

notimetorelax wrote: post #198
azalemeth wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is especially unlikely to be the underlying cause of unexpected and seemingly premature catastrophic SSD failure. One of my graduate students experienced this, the hard way: writing up his thesis, his mum plugged in "the wrong USB C" charger. I don't know exactly what happened, but the board was utterly fried. The problem with the soldered-to-the-motherboard, everything-utterly-encrypted approach is that it's al…

These days I don’t understand why people don’t sync their important files to cloud. Dropbox has a free layer that’s perfectly fit for a theses.

Maybe because not everyone likes to share their most important files with a third party? Or because of providers scanning files or stuff like: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-apple-fbi-icloud-exclusiv...

Re: Apple Silicon Macs can't boot from external drive if internal drive failed

#208

Post by userbinator »

liminalsunset wrote: post #73
jaywalk wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Framework's hardware is entirely open source ( https://github.com/FrameworkComputer/ExpansionCards ) so you can buy parts from any third-party that wants to produce them.

They have open sourced a development toolkit for making expansion card modules but the motherboard itself is not open source. You can, however get schematics if you are a "repair shop", under NDA, however they define that.

I hope the schematics leak, just like they do for many other laptops.

Re: Apple Silicon Macs can't boot from external drive if internal drive failed

#209

Post by kuschku »

slownews45 wrote: post #159
mywittyname wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Being able to swap disks is a meaningful advantage. After all, it's the part most likely to fail first, and often first limitation people hit on a machine. Storage tech is still advancing at a decent clip. In 5 years, there will probably be 4-6TB drives on the market with 2-4x the throughput for the same price as 1TB drives today.

We keep on hearing about folks needing to swap out disks out that are broken who ALSO don't have apple care AND are out of warranty? I mean, how many people is this vs the millions / billions of idevices out there? Apple simplifies / integrates like crazy - that is a focus for them. No separate bios flash - my guess is others start copying them personally. Because apple products hold value so well, I just sell me 2 y…

And the people buying your used devices have no apple care and are out of warranty, so they’ll complain if they can’t repair it.

Apple devices will stop holding value so well the less repairable they get, which in turn will also increase your costs.

Re: Apple Silicon Macs can't boot from external drive if internal drive failed

#210

Post by stocknoob »

notimetorelax wrote: post #198
azalemeth wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is especially unlikely to be the underlying cause of unexpected and seemingly premature catastrophic SSD failure. One of my graduate students experienced this, the hard way: writing up his thesis, his mum plugged in "the wrong USB C" charger. I don't know exactly what happened, but the board was utterly fried. The problem with the soldered-to-the-motherboard, everything-utterly-encrypted approach is that it's al…

These days I don’t understand why people don’t sync their important files to cloud. Dropbox has a free layer that’s perfectly fit for a theses.

Seriously. It's 2021, you should have a remote backup. Use backblaze, tarsnap, anything. SSD failure is one of a thousand ways you can lose access to files on your laptop.
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