Trump’s new social media platform found using Mastodon code • Hacker News Board

Re: Trump’s new social media platform found using Mastodon code

#311

Post by superdisk » Tue, Nov 02, 2021, 1:37 PM UTC

danShumway wrote: post #249

s7r wrote: post #121

In terms of "antithetical values", the machine learning project ml5js.org actually did something about this. They bound their open-source license to a Code of Conduct¹, which forbids the use of their ML software for (1) discriminating against marginalized communities, (2) building tools that disingenuously manipulate public opinion, (3) building tools of mass surveillance and prediction to repress the rights of peopl…

> open-source license to a Code of Conduct Just a minor note, a license that works this way can't be accurately described as Open Source. It's more accurate to say that ml5.js is an Ethical Source license. See https://ethicalsource.dev/ for more details. I'm sure this is a name that will get debated as it becomes more common. But personally, speaking just as an outside observer I really like the name Ethical Source.…

I prefer the classic term, PROPRIETARY software. At least be honest about what this is.

Re: Trump’s new social media platform found using Mastodon code

#312

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Nov 02, 2021, 1:38 PM UTC

s7r wrote: post #121

In terms of "antithetical values", the machine learning project ml5js.org actually did something about this. They bound their open-source license to a Code of Conduct¹, which forbids the use of their ML software for (1) discriminating against marginalized communities, (2) building tools that disingenuously manipulate public opinion, (3) building tools of mass surveillance and prediction to repress the rights of peopl…

[deleted]

Re: Trump’s new social media platform found using Mastodon code

#313

Post by vntok » Tue, Nov 02, 2021, 1:39 PM UTC

rubyist5eva wrote: post #207

FemmeAndroid wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They didn’t ‘officially launch’ but the platform was up and running. There isn’t a ‘you don’t need to comply if it’s an alpha test’ clause in the AGPL.

If you don't legally have access to the platform, you have no claim on license enforcement. The platform wasn't officially launched, and the accounts were used by exploiting a misconfigured page. They are under no obligation to release the source code, yet.

Exactly. Truth Social could actually sue any one claiming they used the platform for abusing a security flaw to obtain and maintain access to a protected computer system. That would be hilarious.

Re: Trump’s new social media platform found using Mastodon code

#314

Post by Robin_Message » Tue, Nov 02, 2021, 1:39 PM UTC

brailsafe wrote: post #179

s7r wrote: post #121

In terms of "antithetical values", the machine learning project ml5js.org actually did something about this. They bound their open-source license to a Code of Conduct¹, which forbids the use of their ML software for (1) discriminating against marginalized communities, (2) building tools that disingenuously manipulate public opinion, (3) building tools of mass surveillance and prediction to repress the rights of peopl…

> discriminating against marginalized communities Only marginalised communities?

The licence surely implies any discrimination being forbidden.

Proof by contradiction: if someone uses this software to discriminate against an apparently non-marginalised community, then that community would be being marginalised in at least one way (by this usage), thus making that community a marginalised community, thus making that usage against the licence.

Re: Trump’s new social media platform found using Mastodon code

#315

Post by macinjosh » Tue, Nov 02, 2021, 1:39 PM UTC

ModernMech wrote: post #296

refurb wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[snark]Almost lost the Republic on Jan 6th to a whole lot of shoving.[/snark] But more seriously it looks like the government is having a hell of a time convicting anyone there of more than mischief and trespassing.

> [snark]Almost lost the Republic on Jan 6th to a whole lot of shoving.[/snark] Snark aside, the danger of Jan 6 was not shoving - It was people deciding to do the wrong thing in the name of gaining power. The insurrectionists who organized January 6 (yes it was planned) were at the Willard Hotel in a number of suites they called a "War Room" (yes, their words). The entire plan was to delay certification of Joe Biden…

> No elections will be trusted by either side after that happens.

This is the Democrats fault. Their shoe-in candidate lost and they spent four years bleating that Trump was illegitimate and failed to prove it with a far reaching investigation. _That_ is where trust started to be lost.

Re: Trump’s new social media platform found using Mastodon code

#316

Post by mananaysiempre » Tue, Nov 02, 2021, 1:39 PM UTC

nuerow wrote: post #301

roenxi wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If all software was licensed that way, 5-15 years would pass then suddenly there'd be a whole bunch of "Wow, Stallman was right again! We should have been using free software licenses!" style articles. Restricting software use to only people approved by the creators is a terrible idea. Society has to operate with some level of trust that even people we disagree with, using methods we don't approve of, have the potent…

> Restricting software use to only people approved by the creators is a terrible idea. Isn't that the whole point of author's rights/intellectual property in general and software licenses in particular?

No, the (original) point is a time-limited monopoly on the use of a creation in order to compensate for creativity (for copyright) or public disclosure (for patent rights; note the use of the word “patent”, originally used for certificates affirming government-enforced monopolies of other kinds as well, e.g. for the exploitation of a colony). Though the French droits d’auteur line of thought works differently, or so I’m told.

Re: Trump’s new social media platform found using Mastodon code

#317

Post by spamizbad » Tue, Nov 02, 2021, 1:40 PM UTC

throwaway420y wrote: post #75

I fail to see how a website that's not up yet is violating any licenses, can anyone tell me more about this ?

The website was up, and claimed it was running proprietary software.

Re: Trump’s new social media platform found using Mastodon code

#318

Post by fdschoeneman » Tue, Nov 02, 2021, 1:40 PM UTC

If I understand correctly, a) the license requires people who use mastodon "over the network" to meet certain requirements and b) the site is not yet live or being used "over the network." If my understanding is correct, the whole story and the commentary linked are a waste of time and I have to question the motives of anyone pushing either. What am I missing?

Re: Trump’s new social media platform found using Mastodon code

#319

Post by naasking » Tue, Nov 02, 2021, 1:40 PM UTC

s7r wrote: post #121

In terms of "antithetical values", the machine learning project ml5js.org actually did something about this. They bound their open-source license to a Code of Conduct¹, which forbids the use of their ML software for (1) discriminating against marginalized communities, (2) building tools that disingenuously manipulate public opinion, (3) building tools of mass surveillance and prediction to repress the rights of peopl…

> (1) discriminating against marginalized communities, (2) building tools that disingenuously manipulate public opinion, (3) building tools of mass surveillance and prediction to repress the rights of people, and (4) building tools that control weapons, including tools that automate the deployment, operation, and targeting of weapons.

Who decides whether the license was violated? That is, what counts as discrimination, what counts as "marginalized", do those differ by country, what counts as "disingenuously manipulating public opinion", what counts as "repressing rights", what counts as "tools that automate the deployment, operation and targeting of weapons".

For instance, can a nuts and bolts manufacturer whose nuts and bolts might be used to assemble pieces of a weapon use that ML project to do quality control of their products? Seems like an unsolvable quagmire.

Re: Trump’s new social media platform found using Mastodon code

#320

Post by rsynnott » Tue, Nov 02, 2021, 1:42 PM UTC

JohnWhigham wrote: post #208

h2odragon wrote: post #14

This (possible but technically not yet a) license violation has gotten more press for OSS licenses and enforcement than anything before, I think. Certainly more press than the Vizio thing, which will actually impact a lot more people if anything comes of it.

Amazon violating open source agreements to host their own version of the product and squeeze the life out of the original company? Not a peep. People whose political opinions differ from my own use the software? This must be stopped at once .

Early days yet, but that Amazon thing got FAR more coverage on this site than the Trump thing has so far.

Now in mainstream press you’re probably correct; this is an uncomplicated story involving an actor who everyone knows doing a fairly simple, obvious bad thing to a non-profit. Obviously that is a much better story than AWS (laypeople do not really know what this is) doing something potentially bad but rather more complex and murky to another for-profit company.