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Truths about video game stories

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Re: Truths about video game stories

#271
post #252

I'd be in the opposite camp. Video game stories are those things I have to quickly click through to get to the next bit of action. Ya, ya, ya, bla, bla, bla, click, click click, don't care. My ideal is to create my own story rather than have it spoon fed to me. Let me roll a character then let me do what I want in an interactive open world. Sure, some curating and minor direction is OK, but the less the better. I don…

I'd tend to agree. I think games need to be better about "picking a camp". Many games try to force a strong narrative into an open world design, and both qualities end up faltering because of it. Examples: Mass Effect, God of War, Horizon Zero Dawn, most Ubisoft games. The best open world games tell very light narrative. They may have tons of lore to fall upon and discover, but there's otherwise very little arc to th…

I think this is really just a matter of subjective values.

Mass Effect, God of War, and Horizon Zero Dawn are in my list of favourite games of all time.

I couldn’t stand Red Dead 2 until I stopped doing the open world things and started just following the story.

Breath of the Wild is cool, but it definitely hasn’t captured me like these other games have.

I have never been able to stick with a Souls games, but I devoured Detroit: Beyond Human and the Telltale Walking Dead games

I’m not saying you’re wrong, but when you ask “is it good?” You need to consider what people are looking for. Personally, I’m looking for something that is technically fun but also leans closer to being an interactive movie/book

Re: Truths about video game stories

#273
post #87

Here are some single player narrative/story driven games which are worth your time and money and also has decent to good storyline. The author seems way too salty over some games I think. - The Last of Us 1 & 2 ( Must play ) - RDR 1&2. ( 2 is must play ) - GTA IV - Mafia 2 - A Plague Tale: Innocence ( must play ) - Metro series. - Inside - Witcher 3 - A Way out ( needs 2 player ) - Night in the woods - Breath of the…

It's been mentioned around on other comments but take a look at Outer Wilds if you have the time, you and I seem to have very overlapping preferences and I was surprised not to see it on your list.

Appreciate the suggestions! Will have to take a look at the few that I haven't yet.

Re: Truths about video game stories

#274

I'd be in the opposite camp. Video game stories are those things I have to quickly click through to get to the next bit of action. Ya, ya, ya, bla, bla, bla, click, click click, don't care. My ideal is to create my own story rather than have it spoon fed to me. Let me roll a character then let me do what I want in an interactive open world. Sure, some curating and minor direction is OK, but the less the better. I don…

This is what I do since, I don't know, King's Quest series? After the death of adventure games I don't care about stories anymore. The graphics and the gameplay carry all the weight now. The Assassin's Creed series-what is this Animus crap? Just make the character be that assassin guy instead of switching to some pandering story about a time computer. Seeing what they did to ancient settings and bringing these cities…

I can’t stand that animus stuff honestly I usually turn it off after one of those scenes just to wash it away. Totally destroys the game for me (which I only just started with origins and odyssey)

Re: Truths about video game stories

#275
I rarely play video games,but when I do, it's because the ones I pick give me a more immersive story than watching a movie. So, I'm on the camp that believes in playing for the story, and I don't play so much that the amazing stories in most games I've played become boring.

Re: Truths about video game stories

#276

Many video games have very poor or bare plots, but amazing settings. In fact, I'm not sure that video games are actually good vehicles for plots. Video games are interactive, but all good plots require careful pacing and timing in order to be successful. It's possible to force this in a game, but the more you do, the more the game becomes an interactive movie. A great example would be Dark Souls: incredible setting,…

I guess the problem with plot on video games is the sequencing. Some of the most impactful stories I've experienced in games have been more environmental storytelling than plot based. That is, the game expects me to find the overall narrative and story in my own time, usually because the story beats have happened already before my character even existed, and I'm trying to find where the current gameplay fits into it,…

This is something which didn't come through in my original post, but I feel one of the major problems here is that people are trying to compare video games to other mediums such as theatre, movies, and books. In other words, video games are an art form which is different enough that direct comparisons to other art forms may be misleading. Now I realize that we are talking about the general quality of plot in games, and not the wider debate regarding whether video games constitute art. That said, imagine the complaint that music is not art because it lacks a proper plot. Video games have aspects of other mediums, but the interactive nature of games means that they will never really be directly comparable.

For example, in film school you might study aspects of film which are somewhat oblique to the quality of the actual storytelling in the film. Such as: cinematography, and the framing of characters in the shot. Video games have analogous things, such as level design, game design, etc. A famous example is how the first level of Super Mario Bros. teaches you that mushrooms are beneficial, by making the player's first interaction with one mostly unavoidable. Modern games have more complex game designs, and of course these designs represent a complex communication between the game creators and the players. A lot of nuance an information is conveyed this way, and it can potentially amount to art. Much like the art of cinematography cannot exist in books, the art of game design cannot exist in other mediums.

Video games can also teach you things which movies and books cannot, (at least potentially) and this can be performed via game design. For example, when I was a child, people would exclaim "life's not a video game!" I heard this quite a bit, and I believe most people meant: the things you do have consequences, and you won't get very many second chances. Now this is frankly not really correct. Yes, the things you do have consequences, but almost everyone gets multiple second chances throughout their life. For example, if I fail at one task in a workplace, I usually get multiple chances to improve and correct my error. Even if I fail overall at a job, I will likely have future chances to prove myself at other jobs. Some mistakes can be fatal, of course, but for most of the actions I take, I can plan on success by trial and error, repetition, and iteration. In other words, exactly like a video game. Interestingly, it was video games which first taught me this. I had a friend who by all accounts was objectively not as talented at video games than I was. We'd play together, and I'd best him at nearly everything we touched. However one day he wanted to take on a challenge in a game which I felt was above my skill level. I was certain he'd never be able to succeed, because I was certain I could never succeed. But, he had something I didn't at the time: persistence. He kept trying and failing, and trying again. He never became discouraged or emotionally frustrated, and slowly he iterated on his failure and eventually succeeded. (To be clear here, when I say "iterate on failure," I simply mean to attempt a task, fail at it, and attempt it slightly better the next time.) I learned a very important lesson that day, and have been re-learning it ever since: part of success is persistence, and things which seem impossible are often simply daunting. Later in life, Dark Souls and other From Software games reinforced these lessons, and of course much more importantly, I applied these lessons to my everyday life and learned not to fear failure, and to iterate on failure until it became success. I bring this up specifically because I remember years ago reading an interview with a celebrity who felt that video games could not be art. I believe it was Roger Ebert, but I'm not sure. In either case, the argument was made that art teaches you something, something about human nature, something about being a person. It's possible I'm misremembering the argument, (I can't find it online) but my point is the same. Video games taught me something about being a person which other mediums failed to teach me.

Re: Truths about video game stories

#277
post #202
post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Games were showing rather then telling long before half life. That was not something special. I don't know whether people here did not played games other then half life back then or half life is only thing they remember. And the difference between full cit scene and what happened in half life was really really minor.

But not in first person, you-are-present-in-a-3D-world games? At least I'm not remembering any that felt like Half Life 1 did. The difference between a cut scene and embodying a character while things happen around you isn't a minor thing for many of us.

The castle of wolfestein or doom are both significantly older and allow more freedom. System shock was a year later and allowed actual tactical choices and somewhat strategical o es.

Half life was part of pattern of moving towards extremely linear. It had better graphics than normal at the time. It had attempt at actual story. It was not move toward more agency to the player nor toward subtlety.

It had less choices than normal at the time, not even in terms of whether to hide on left or right, less options for tactical decisions, less of anything like that.

Re: Truths about video game stories

#278
post #87

Here are some single player narrative/story driven games which are worth your time and money and also has decent to good storyline. The author seems way too salty over some games I think. - The Last of Us 1 & 2 ( Must play ) - RDR 1&2. ( 2 is must play ) - GTA IV - Mafia 2 - A Plague Tale: Innocence ( must play ) - Metro series. - Inside - Witcher 3 - A Way out ( needs 2 player ) - Night in the woods - Breath of the…

Prey was interesting too, and I also enjoyed Deathloop from the same studio (story is mediocre, but the way you discover it during the gameplay is very compelling).

From telltale, I enjoyed also tales from the borderland.

I guess the list should also contain a lot of eastern RPGs. Final Fantasy (e.g. the FF7 remake) and similar titles have a lot of story.

Life is strange part 2 was a huge disappoinment. There is a subpar story in the game, and literally zero gameplay (click a button every 5 minutes - without exageration). Probably more for people who are interested in the atmosphere of the game than anything else.

Re: Truths about video game stories

#279
post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Games were showing rather then telling long before half life. That was not something special. I don't know whether people here did not played games other then half life back then or half life is only thing they remember. And the difference between full cit scene and what happened in half life was really really minor.

You're gonna have to list some pre-Half-Life games that did a better job.

Wolfestein or doom. The thing is, half life allowed exactly zero choice. So anything where you can go back or have a choice between opening left or right door is better in terms of player agency.

In terms of showing rather then telling via text, almost anything has that aspect.

Half life had very good graphics for the time. That is where it shined.

Re: Truths about video game stories

#280
This article is refreshingly honest about the general inanity of video games. Does anyone have a compelling explanation why video games are such an artistic wasteland even compared to other mainstream forms of entertainment like TV or cinema?
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