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Effect of early treatment with fluvoxamine on risk of hospitalization for Covid

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Re: Effect of early treatment with fluvoxamine on risk of hospitalization for Covid

#71

Post by nradov »

hacksnewer wrote: post #36
loudtieblahblah wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Prior to studies being done, how do we evaluate who is a quack and who is correct You allow the dialog to take place and make up your own mind. >I would argue that anyone who had a solution to Covid should rush to get it published in a reputable Any tool thats not a vaccine gets associated with Trump or the right wing and is dismissed. Its even stifled funding for anti-virals that give a 50% reduction in hospitaliza…

How many people actually have the expertise to evalaute medical data like that? They don't. There's a very very small number of Hners that if they are honest with themselves are qualified to do that. I'm not saying that from a high and mghty position, I'm doing that from a place that I see HN talk incredibly ignorantly about all the time. HN is supposed to be smart. You give the average person the ability to do "rese…

So are you proposing that we restrict access to PubMed? Because right now there's nothing stopping anyone from doing their own research.

Re: Effect of early treatment with fluvoxamine on risk of hospitalization for Covid

#72

Post by s1artibartfast »

didibus wrote: post #65
s1artibartfast wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Why is the absolute 5% and the RR 32%? What's the difference? Absolute reduction is compared to control in absolute terms (16% hospitalized in control minus 11% with treatment = 5%). Relative risk reduction is the absolute reduction divided by hospitalizations in the control (5%/16%) Absolute % tells you how big the effect is, relative risk tells you how big it is in comparison to the reference. >Why wouldn't they m…

Thanks for the explanation, I can much better understand the data now. What about the BCI? How does the Bayesian confidence interval and the P value differ ?

Bayesian confidence interval is an estimated range of the difference if it exists, while P value is the chance that a difference exists at all.

E.g. you could do a study and find:

Men are taller than women on average P= 0.001 ( extremely likely) BCI = 5-10 inches taller

Re: Effect of early treatment with fluvoxamine on risk of hospitalization for Covid

#73

Post by radu_floricica »

hhw3h wrote: post #5

What's interesting is Steve Kirsch was touting this months ago alongside Robert Malone and Bret Weinstein. That content got banned from YouTube. Was more or less harm done by stifling this information? In the desire to drive official therapeutics and vaccines was this potentially not surfaced as fast as it could have been? I'm not sure. It's good food for thought though.

Months?! I have a box bought "just in case" almost a year ago, and I easn't early.

We as a civilization moved pretty slow on Covid.

Re: Effect of early treatment with fluvoxamine on risk of hospitalization for Covid

#74

Post by nradov »

javagram wrote: post #39
chiefalchemist wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The government could have spent the last 18 months encouraging people to lose weight, stop smoking, drinking, and eating fast food. Instead, the "solution" did the opposite. But worse, kids stayed inside, didn't exercise, put on (likely more) weight, didn't share illness (read: weakened immune system) and then those kids were ordered back to school in that highly vulnerable state. The solution? The jab. With absolu…

If you seriously think the government could have made us all lose weight in the last 18 months... they’ve been running anti obesity campaigns for decades and failing while obesity grows every year. BTW covid is plenty dangerous to non obese as well. The vaccine shot actually works well and is incredibly easy to use compared to a grueling year long weight loss and sustaining it for a lifetime, for most people.

Obesity is a critical risk factor.

https://www.wfae.org/health/2021-09-30/novant-says-9-of-10-c...

https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-3742#f1-M203742

https://www.cdc.gov/obesity/data/obesity-and-covid-19.html

https://bjsm.bmj.com/content/early/2021/07/21/bjsports-2021-...

Re: Effect of early treatment with fluvoxamine on risk of hospitalization for Covid

#75

Post by nradov »

msbarnett wrote: post #33
bananapear wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aren't there many (>60) published studies showing varying positive effects of early treatment with Ivermectin though? (Despite a couple having been retracted for obvious fraud). YouTube's policy specifically bans mention of Ivermectin as a possible treatment. Combined with the safety profile and cost of Ivermectin, I'd have thought that it'd at least be worth a try in an emergency - the worst possible case being that…

> Aren't there many (>60) published studies showing varying positive effects of early treatment with Ivermectin though? (Despite a couple having been retracted for obvious fraud). There are a number of low-quality (low numbers, methodological issue) studies with varying results. The primary "evidence" that got people excited about Ivermectin was a meta-analysis of these studies, but the meta-analysis itself pointed o…

Apparently you haven't kept up on current research. Multiple studies have shown that vitamin D has prevention and treatment benefits. There's more going on than just a correlation with age.

https://vitamin-d-covid.shotwell.ca/

Re: Effect of early treatment with fluvoxamine on risk of hospitalization for Covid

#76

Post by nradov »

wtallis wrote: post #45
bsaul wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if you want youtube to get rid of any salesmen touting miracles anything you're going to have to get rid of commercials as well.

There's a big difference between charlatans touting miracle cures and commercials for FDA-approved drugs, but even the latter are considered by many reasonable people to be harmful and worthy of banning.

Banning ads for legal products to adults would require a Constitutional amendment.

Re: Effect of early treatment with fluvoxamine on risk of hospitalization for Covid

#77

Post by ceejayoz »

spookthesunset wrote: post #69
javagram wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you seriously think the government could have made us all lose weight in the last 18 months... they’ve been running anti obesity campaigns for decades and failing while obesity grows every year. BTW covid is plenty dangerous to non obese as well. The vaccine shot actually works well and is incredibly easy to use compared to a grueling year long weight loss and sustaining it for a lifetime, for most people.

These public health “experts” didn’t even try. They basically treated covid like it was the Black Plague for everybody, when that is far from the truth. The truth is covid is a risk for a very specific set of the population. They made very little (no?) mention of how most people recover just fine. No mention of how stratified the risks are based on age. No mention about how it goes after the obese. None of that. Inst…

This really doesn't track with even basic fact checking.

They didn't treat it like the Black Death; if anything, death estimates were way too low.

https://www.npr.org/2020/04/09/830664814/fauci-says-u-s-coro...

> The final toll currently "looks more like 60,000 than the 100,000 to 200,000" that U.S. officials previously estimated, Fauci said.

As for obesity and age, they were pretty clear on that:

https://www.fiercehealthcare.com/practices/fauci-offers-upda...

> "It’s so clear that the overwhelming weight of serious disease and mortality is on those who are elderly and those with a serious comorbidity: heart disease, chronic lung disease, diabetes, obesity, respiratory difficulties," said Anthony Fauci, M.D., director of the National Institutes of Health's National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases.

> "There will be outliers, as we’ve seen with influenza, [a person] who is young and healthy who winds up getting COVID-19, [gets] seriously ill and dies," Fauci said in a taped interview with Howard Bauchner, M.D., editor of the Journal of the American Medical Association. "But if you look at the weight of the data the risk group is very, very clear."

You're getting mad at imaginary experts.

Re: Effect of early treatment with fluvoxamine on risk of hospitalization for Covid

#78

Post by nradov »

disabled wrote: post #32

I wouldn’t touch flovoxamine or any other antidepressent (or antipsychotic for that matter) with a 10 foot stick. If you want a good read about how the ** y the US healthcare system is, this is a very worthwhile read. Ironically the author is the screenwriter of “Girl, Interrupted” and the story she writes is about how her son got screwed by the US healthcare system and is titled “Boy, Interrupted”. It also shows you…

Your rant isn't relevant here. Everyone knows that Fluvoxamine has some negative side effects and risks. As a potential COVID-19 treatment it would be used for only a few days during the acute infection phase. Not as an ongoing treatment like for mental health conditions.

Re: Effect of early treatment with fluvoxamine on risk of hospitalization for Covid

#79

Post by ceejayoz »

nradov wrote: post #76
wtallis wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a big difference between charlatans touting miracle cures and commercials for FDA-approved drugs, but even the latter are considered by many reasonable people to be harmful and worthy of banning.

Banning ads for legal products to adults would require a Constitutional amendment.

Nah.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Health_Cigarette_Smokin...

Re: Effect of early treatment with fluvoxamine on risk of hospitalization for Covid

#80

Post by hdjjhhvvhga »

SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #47
hdjjhhvvhga wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But this is exactly where we should double our efforts, because the problem is technical: we do have lots of data to analyze already. The influence of anti-histamine drugs was relatively quickly discovered because everybody expected asthma patients would get worse and the opposite was happening, so this was an obvious thing to examine. But many more drugs may play a role and these are hiding in plain sight - I hope r…

I'm not saying it wouldn't be a good idea if it was possible, but do we have enough sanitized, high quality, and complete medical data to pull that off? Given the number of potential interactions with all the different medications and conditions, could we actually pull out those links without a ton of confounding variables? Would it produce signal, or just noise?

Given enormous resources spent on everything COVOD-related, from tests and vaccines to the costs of lockdowns and restrictions, I think we should at least try to analyze the data looking for the low-hanging fruit, then try to account for confounding factors, and if still interesting look at it closer. Not easy, but definitely possible for large hospitals - they do have enough data, they just need competent people to analyze them and make preliminary findings.

On the other hand, we are probably most interested in patients who got infected but did not end up in a hospital. Were they taking any meds routinely? I don't think it's easy to gather this kind of data unless people share them voluntarily with an organization they trust.

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