Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm • Hacker News Board

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#211

Post by Bradlinc » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 2:58 PM UTC

gbronner wrote: post #151

jefftk wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So little privacy? The first three of my four years in college I had shared rooms; only had a single my senior year. I think that's reasonably common? This is much more privacy than that. (Lack of windows is much more of an issue from my perspective)

As long as the ventilation is good, I don't care about the windows -- the idea is that you should use your bedroom for sleeping at night, and go socialize and learn about things elsewhere. I suspect that a lot of night-owl students will actually appreciate the lack of windows and roommates -- they'll sleep better.

I agree. Had I been given the choice of no windows or no roommates, I would choose no roommates.

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#212

Post by aaron695 » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 2:59 PM UTC

mindcrime wrote: post #91

From my point-of-view as a former firefighter, I would say this: A building meant to house 4500 students, with only two entrances? There's a word for that: deathtrap. Building this is setting UCSB up to be the site of the next Triangle Shirtwaist Factory fire[1], Station Nightclub fire[2], or Hamlet Chicken Processing Plant fire[3]. At a first glance, based only on the information provided in the article, I'd say tha…

$200 million+ and no one raised fire safety because they hadn't read Wikipedia?

The are far more that 'two entrances' on the plans. What are you talking about? What plans are you analysing? I count 12 not including things like the laundry and lobby exits, which are also inter-linked.

What's wrong with HN. This is a really interesting project. Tech is getting very cool for dense living. And we know dense communities increases innovation and is the most environmental thing you can do.

Anyone who's dealt with architects know they are the absolute worst. It's all about looks not usability. The widows is controversial, but that's the point. A system that works without windows changes the game. And university students are not old HN people who want to live their entire day in a room.

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#213

Post by indymike » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 2:59 PM UTC

vmception wrote: post #199

yaacov wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> just because money Money is really important, probably the single most important constraint for state universities.

yes, I understand the perverse incentives that led to greenlighting this. its also not an excuse. they should reject the $200 million donation and hope Munger sends another with no restrictions. that's where we are at.

Maybe build the $200M dorm instead of the $2B dorm?

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#214

Post by nescioquid » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 2:59 PM UTC

ajross wrote: post #142

mindcrime wrote: post #91

From my point-of-view as a former firefighter, I would say this: A building meant to house 4500 students, with only two entrances? There's a word for that: deathtrap. Building this is setting UCSB up to be the site of the next Triangle Shirtwaist Factory fire[1], Station Nightclub fire[2], or Hamlet Chicken Processing Plant fire[3]. At a first glance, based only on the information provided in the article, I'd say tha…

Surely building codes mandate a comprehensive evacuation design. There are clearly aesthetic complaints many people will have here, but realistically safety shouldn't be a problem. This is simply not a "large" building by skyscraper standards, and those can be built safely. Honestly... I think this is very much a taste thing. Is it so weird that I don't think this looks so bad at all? Yeah, yeah, no windows. But dens…

Former firefighter cautions we should be skeptical of the safety of this plan, and your rebuttal is "surely building codes mandate..."? A zero-evidence rebuttal concerning the safety of 4500 students.

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#215

Post by karaterobot » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 2:59 PM UTC

I appreciate the architect being willing to resign in protest over what he believes is an irresponsible action that will damage the students' well-being. We need people willing to put their reputation and finances on the line when they think something is dangerous.

Personally, I'm not convinced by the argument he's making though. I'd like to see some evidence that not having a window in your sleeping quarters is psychologically damaging: I suspect it's not been uncommon in many places in the world, and throughout history.

On the other hand, I'd like to see evidence that Munger's idea, that the students will spend less time alone in their rooms and more time in a shared environment, will play out. I saw the reviews of the existing dormitory he'd built, but I don't consider that rigorous.

In general, I'd just like to see evidence once way or the other rather than knee-jerk speculation. Maybe I should get out of this thread.

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#216

Post by ghaff » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 3:00 PM UTC

aristophenes wrote: post #196

baggy_trough wrote: post #19

I’d rather have no roommate than a window.

You’d have seven roommates and would also have no window. Looking at the layout, it’s like sharing a tiny apartment with 7 other people. This is the worst part, if you have one disruptive person out of eight, they are going to make everyone else miserable. Hard to get sleep, hard to study.

The dorm I was in undergrad had a suite type of arrangement. (Though the rooms were not all singles and they mostly had usable windows.) IMO, it's preferable to the long corridor with rooms coming off of it.

The lack of windows seems not great and perhaps the massiveness as well. But the basic idea of groups of rooms sharing a common area is fine by itself.

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#217

Post by finnh » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 3:00 PM UTC

ctdonath wrote: post #86

krembanan wrote: post #5

Are there no laws against this in the U.S? In Norway there are building codes that prohibits bedrooms without a real window.

Are such laws necessary? if you want to not live there, don't.

This thread is full of people discussing a topic. Your comment here and elsewhere in this thread doesn't add much - "hey anybody with anything critical to say about anything, just don't use it" applies equally to ANY topic, and isn't the great insight you seem to think bears repeating.

[EDIT: sorry, that probably comes across as harsh. My point is that this whole site is for people to discuss things, and your comment(s) seem to advocate that people stop doing exactly that]

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#218

Post by wayoutthere » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 3:00 PM UTC

theroqwpeo wrote: post #75

daniel-thompson wrote: post #24

Munger also did the same thing for the University of Michigan's graduate residence building^; 95% of the rooms have no windows. ^ https://housing.umich.edu/residence-hall/munger/

Reviews of this residence: https://www.veryapt.com/ApartmentReview-a7222-munger-graduat...

This is a graduate residence hall and graduate students tend to be a much higher mix of foreign students — looking at the reviews, many are praising that it’s pre-furnished and they didn’t need to do a whole lot to get set up. It’s also been my experience that foreign students (particularly from Asia) are just used to cramped, windowless accommodations like this for student housing so it’s not as dystopian-feeling to them.

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#219

Post by Gare » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 3:00 PM UTC

raldi wrote: post #117

notRobot wrote: post #17

No windows? No natural light whatsoever? That's gotta have a serious negative impact on the mental health (and possibly sleep patterns?) of the students. Not to mention that in case of a fire, all the people rushing to the two exits will get into a stampede, and those who remain in their rooms will suffocate, with no windows to open for fresh air or to be rescued from? This is the most dystopian thing I've heard of i…

There are tons of windows and natural light in the common areas; the design is meant to encourage congregation there. The bedrooms are just for sleeping, dressing, and sex.

I count 64 bedrooms per "house". That's a lot of people for a single common area that doesn't seem that big.

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#220

Post by animal_spirits » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 3:00 PM UTC

proteal wrote: post #183

I think I understand where they’re coming from by designing such a large, on-campus dorm. There’s limited space at UCSB to physically house kids nearby. If you look at the map, there’s only one walkable community to UCSB and that consists of rented single family homes (2,000 sqft shacks) that you cram 20-30 students in. I would argue that living in the dystopian mega dorm might make more sense for lots of students wh…

Why does UCSB admit so many students it obviously can't support? That seems to be a big issue. I saw it happen when I was at Purdue too. They started putting bunkbeds in the _public_ dorm lobby because they couldn't support all the students they admitted. Its ridiculous that universities are doing this to their students.